NIS America Explains The Changes In Criminal Girls: Invite Only

By Spencer . July 11, 2014 . 11:13am

Criminal Girls: Invite Only will be released in North America and Europe next year. The PlayStation Vita game follows a group of girls in Hell who have to climb a tower to be reincarnated. The battle system is unique since you give the characters, each representing a different vice, orders in battle and sometimes they won’t listen to you because they haven’t been trained.

 

You can change this stat by using the punish system, which NIS America confirms will be in the Western version. All of the core gameplay mechanics will be in Criminal Girls: Invite Only. A statement sent to Siliconera from NIS America explains the minor changes and why they made them.

 

A key part of our localization philosophy is keeping games as true to the original as possible when we bring them to the West. Unfortunately due to rating issues and regional regulations, we sometimes have to work with our developers to make minor changes to game content.

 

These decisions are never made lightly, and whenever we do make them, it comes after working closely with the various rating boards as well as the developer . Making the changes necessary to release some of our more niche titles in the West is not, and never has been, an attempt at making the game more appealing to a larger audience. We know that censoring a game would lose just as many fans as it may potentially bring in.

 

For Criminal Girls, the changes the developer is making do not change any of the core game play mechanics. They are modifying the amount of fog that remains in some scenes as well as removing the Japanese audio from those same scenes.

 

Ultimately, our goal is to make games available to our fans in the West, and to keep those same games as close to their original as is possible. Regrettably, without changes, some games would not be able to be released here—as is the case with Criminal Girls: Invite Only.

 

We apologize for this situation and we hope that you will stand by us as we continue to bring as many creative, fun, and exciting products as we possibly can. Thank you for your support.


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  • Slickyslacker

    I commend them for recognizing how much B.S. localizing, but censoring a fanservice game is. I suppose they believe that, for the sake of posterity, the Western release of the game SHOULD be censored – to be congruous with cultural standards and sentiments at the time.

    It should be unconditionally clear that no publisher wants the “A” ESRB rating slapped onto their games. That’s essentially a death sentence in the gaming industry. For a corporation like NISA to make that kind of sacrifice would be ridiculous and out of their realm of possibility.

    If you want to see more pantsu and feminine parts, import the Japanese version. Be thankful the Vita isn’t region-locked. That’s all.

    • Taedirk

      >It should be unconditionally clear that no publisher wants the “AO” ESRB
      rating slapped onto their games. That’s essentially a death sentence in
      the gaming industry.

      Bingo. Retailers won’t touch an AO game (anyone remember when GTA pulled a temporary rating change) and you can’t really get away with not having an ESRB rating on consoles anymore. It has to be an odd area where they find games like this they want to bring over even knowing some aspects will get axed in the process and the kind of reaction that brings.

      • X_Bacon

        Funny thing is, this time it was probably because of some rating board in Europe, not ESRB. And since NISA can’t/won’t make separate releases with different content where needed, everyone has to pay for it.

        • Audie Bakerson

          No, it’s just NISA being idiots. If they actually had been told by some ratings board, why wouldn’t they just say so and spare themselves the hatred? The only answer that fits is they never did.

          • X_Bacon

            I just really wish to believe they wouldn’t make the same mistake twice (thrice?). >_>

          • Matthew Wong

            NISA’s Houk:
            “But I would like to note that we did get in touch with all of the rating boards about this title, providing them with sample scenes, images, and dialogue from the game. Based on their feedback, we decided these changes would be necessary in order to make a release possible in all regions.”

          • Audie Bakerson

            How nice of them to avoid saying which ones.

          • Matthew Wong

            Really? Yeah they sent the credits…the ratings board felt the game was to Japanese because of all the Japanese names…

            They sent mini game scenes, why bother making false accusations?

          • Audie Bakerson

            If they said which it would be easy to verify. Not saying which make it impossible.

            This is ALWAYS cause for suspicion with anything.

          • Matthew Wong

            Actually, Houk was quoted as saying they sent the “most extreme footage”….

          • Audie Bakerson

            Which rating boards supposedly objected, not what footage.

          • Robert Cisneros

            well then do not release the game in those areas last i heard the vita was region free and amazon is good with international shipping…. from the guy who bought Ni no Kuni on europes amazon got it shiped to america and payed less then if he had bought it from bandais store

        • Yaro

          Look up pictures of demon gaze, its PEGI 12, in Europe.

          • X_Bacon

            And then there’s the thing with Agarest 2. America may be sensitive to sexual content as a whole, but I think Europe (or certain parts of it, at least) is much harsher when it comes to lolis.

          • Raw

            Seen, Liked, Purchased.

          • Yaro

            I should consider the career of a salesman…have fun, its a an alright game.

        • Mnoz

          Europe ? I don’t think so, even Monster Monpiece got a PEGI 12 rating here.

  • otakumike

    http://i.imgur.com/4JRulbg.jpg

    C’mon, if I can see a dude’s peen I think I can see other things. xD

    • X_Bacon

      Haha, what game is this?

      • BUG

        That’s Grand Theft Auto 5, they got a huge fanbase and make lots of money so they can get all the fanservice they want.
        Society seems to allow adult male nudity without any problem. I think we could see a Criminal Girls if you get to punish adult males like that game.

        • http://linkapics.tumblr.com/ Linka

          Funnily this is something I had sorta wanted to say earlier, but couldn’t figure out the words. I remember reading way back when that at least in movies, sexual content with women gets rated harsher than men, and I feel like this is the same thing with games. It may have to do with standards specifically, especially NA, which seems especially harsh on sexual themes compared to some countries. (though not Australia, good lord.)

          So weird to say, but your statement would likely be true, but I wouldn’t quote myself on it.

          • BUG

            People find hurting/ humiliating females in general as offensive. I think in Japan traditional, females didn’t mind being controlled by men (but I don’t think now).
            The male species has been known for causing harm or taking advantage of females. Feminism isn’t bad if they think logically but of a few radicals can get overboard and people take them seriously for some falsehoods.

        • X_Bacon

          Thanks. I never knew about this scene in GTA5, but I’m not exactly a fan either…

  • biskmater

    That doesn’t sound…too bad, I guess.

  • http://linkapics.tumblr.com/ Linka

    And here people were thinking they’d just take out the punishment scenes wholesale. This is why you wait before jumping the gun.

    Good on NISA for explaining the situation and also clarifying their words about bringing it to a bigger audience (which I knew meant bringing it out at all in places, not “aiming for people other than the ones who’d be buying this”), and I hope they truck on through the backlash they get otherwise.

    Sadly, I imagine there will still be backlash, since any form of censorship is considered to be an abhorrent sin to some, regardless of reason, but at least attention will be given to the game otherwise.

    • otakumike

      Oh definitely, all the major review websites are gonna hammer this game.

      • AkuLord3

        He meant from fans…we all major reviewers aren’t going like it big deal no surprise, who cares.

        • http://linkapics.tumblr.com/ Linka

          Ahaha, yeah, major reviewers aren’t gonna care for this game at all. But I think normal fans of niche RPGs are almost used to that by now– shoot, I think some of them get a laugh out of it.

      • http://linkapics.tumblr.com/ Linka

        Like AkuLord3 said, I did mean the fans more than anything. It’s no surprise that reviewers will slam the game.

        • Robert Cisneros

          depends on the reviewer, take jim sterling for example he tends to be fairly balanced and fair to games also monpiece just got a 7/10 on dtoid from a WOMAN which surprised me to say the least

    • Shinobikens

      Please the only people truly interested in the game are the people who wanted all the stuff they’re censoring. People who really support the cuts are people who won’t even buy it

      • http://linkapics.tumblr.com/ Linka

        Please speak for yourself. I’ve been curious about the game regardless of things like punishment scenes, because I A) Enjoy NIS’s properties and always want to give them a try, and B) I like RPGs, especially ones that try to introduce new twists to the gameplay, like this and it’s essentially dice-roll of choices at the start of turns.

        Do not assume the whole audience for this game is actually the ones who wanted to punish girls. It might be a part of the audience, but it’s not the whole.

        • Shinobikens

          I don’t think you realize that the punishment scenes are actually a core gameplay mechanic

          • http://linkapics.tumblr.com/ Linka

            I fully realize that the punishment scenes are a core mechanic and are for the purpose of altering the character AI in order to make them more cooperative in battles.

            Just because they are a core mechanic, does not mean they are the entire game.

          • Shinobikens

            They pretty much are. They’re what makes the game more unique and is it’s main selling point. It’s just another generic dungeon crawler without it

          • http://linkapics.tumblr.com/ Linka

            I can understand that point; I looked up the video gameplay of this just a bit ago so I could have a better understanding of the game that was ahead of us. It is, most definitely, a dungeon crawler game. The AI dice-roll of options though at the start of each turn is what I mean by trying to add other twists to it, and yes, punishment minigame is what ties into that.

            More my point is that my interest in the game isn’t solely on the visual content that comes with the punishment minigame as a result, but more what applications come with combining the AI effects and also how an RPG would work as a result of it.

            And you know, like I said, big NIS property supporter. That too.

          • Shinobikens

            I can understand supporting NIS but idk how you can stomach supporting NISA with all the shit they do to games they localize and I don’t mean just censorship which is bad enough

          • http://linkapics.tumblr.com/ Linka

            The biggest complaints I tend to hear center on either a lack of voice acting, or censorship in Mugen Souls and Criminal Girls, or buggy programming. Or them splitting Danganronpa and Danganronpa 2 for the America release (despite the fact that text translation is very pricey, along with voice acting, and the only reason they were together in the first place was cause the games were separate releases beforehand.)

            Now believe me, I’m aware of a lot of NISA’s faults. I’m still angry that the DLC for Disgaea 2: Dark Hero Days is just /so badly programmed/. I’m still kinda mad that Mugen Souls Z has a pretty bad gamebreaking bug, which stops it from being what I’ve heard is a much better game than the original. I’m still mad that we got two extra releases of Phantom Brave (which is a great game, don’t get me wrong), but as a result of the PSP’s life in the West, we didn’t get La Pucelle Ragnarok or Makai Kingdom Portable.

            There are a lot of things that go wrong with a company, and I know there are things they do where they just drop the ball, but it doesn’t stop me from not only enjoying their games, since god knows I’m much happier with them than upset with them– but also buying their products when I can.

            Maybe it might be weird from your point of view as a result, but it’s much the same that it’s weird to me that people slam on them extra hard on the same tone.

          • Shinobikens

            They get slammed because 90% of their games have game breaking bugs and/or shitty/sketchy translations. I mean D2 melted PS3 CPUs when it first came out. As a company there’s a certain level of quality that’s expected and NISA almost never meets it. I’m glad they lost the rights to Neptunia because now I don’t have to support them for buying it

          • http://linkapics.tumblr.com/ Linka

            I suppose. I will admit that NISA could do a /lot/ better in terms of quality of their games, but I think bugs/translations are definitely my higher priority to focus on them getting fixed than censorship. But I guess it’s as much different priorities between people than anything else.

            I didn’t hear anything about Disgaea 2 melting PS3 CPUs, though, unless if you’re speaking of a different D2? Do you mean Disgaea Dimensions 2, maybe, or?

          • Shinobikens

            NISA’s previous fuckups :

            (Those
            with question marks have been rumored but cannot be entirely verified so take
            those with a grain of salt)

            AR
            TONELICO ELEMIA, MANA KHEMIA 1 and 2

            o Bad
            string handling leading to complete crash against specific bosses (AT1, MK2) /
            major part of the extra dungeon enemies (MK1). MK2′s crash is rather easy to
            avoid, though.

            o MK1:
            Unnecessary and flagrant name changes to a variety of playable main characters.

            o MK2:
            Lack of testing in the extra chapter leads to crashes when doing certain tasks
            if Ulrika is the main character instead of Raze: Student handbook and Job post
            usage crash the game.

            AR
            TONELICO METAFALICA

            o
            Typographical errors, missing words, and shaky sentences, mistranslation of
            important game terms, inconsistently-adapted names

            o
            Localization introduced or exposed game-crashing bugs in the game.

            o NISA
            marketed the game based on Sex Appeal, when, in fact, AT2 was intended to be a
            more serious and thoughtful game, with less emphasis on cheap hooks and a
            greater focus on the plot, than Ar Tonelico Elemia

            o In
            order to fit English voice acting onto the disc, they cut approximately half of
            the Japanese voice-acted scenes, leaving many important plot points lacking
            appropriate impact.

            AR
            TONELICO QOGA

            o
            Typographical errors and untranslated text in various spots on top of their
            “translation” not even being remotely close to the japanese track and
            english voice track, what little there is, not even matching the text in some
            areas.

            o
            Binary Field (DLC episodes) scam where they put out each chapter separate then
            a few days after a bundle pack which didn’t work if you had downloaded the
            first episode.

            HYPERDIMENSION
            NEPTUNIA

            o
            Neptunia 1 would crash on the dungeon leaderboard screen if it couldn’t upload
            your score while you were on PSN for whatever reason.

            HYPERDMENSION NEPTUNIA mk2

            o Very
            questionable localization quality. (bad translation, unfunny jokes/lines added
            to several dialogues which changed the characters personalities at times)

            HYPERSIMENSION
            NEPTUNIA V

            o Very
            questionable localization quality. (bad translation, unfunny jokes/lines added
            to several dialogues which changed the characters personalities at times)

            o
            Didn’t tell the gamers idol events DLC would not be included, then, when
            brought to attention, denied any and all knowledge of such DLC.

            o
            Freezing issues with some DLC.

            WITCH
            AND 100 KNIGHT

            o
            Game-crashing bugs (rumour about a GameFAQs user fixing everything and mailed
            such solution/file to NISA. Still no official support nearly a half year from
            release, nor token mention of any such thing.)

            o
            Mediocre translation. Added jokes and nonsense to dialogue.

            o PS3
            overheating (Confirmed to be replicable by person who originally made the post)
            http://nisamerica.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=14425&start=90

            ATELIER
            ARLAND TRILOGY

            o Name
            changing: Esty Erhart => Esty Dee (S T D = Sexual Transmission Disease, get
            it? XD)

            RHAPSODY
            DS

            o
            http://www.siliconera.com/2008/10/13/bonus-content-cut-from-rhapsody-ds/

            o
            http://www.siliconera.com/2008/10/14/falling-flat-encountering-rhapsodys-ds-glitches/

            DISGAEA
            2 PSP

            o They
            fucked up the dlc characters so they don’t have voices.

            o They
            decided not to release all the dlc characters, but released the final
            character, majin hinako.

            o
            Majin hinako unlocks item book collection slots because it assumes you have the
            other dlc characters.

            o Downloading
            majin hinkao means you can’t complete the collection book, effectively killing
            anyone going for 100%

            DISGAEA
            D2

            o
            Game-crashing SKILLS (several Fire-based)

            o
            OPENING stops abruptly

            o
            Fuuka and Desco were free DLC for the first month after release in Japan and
            Asia. Day 1 paid DLC in USA and EU.

            CPU
            melting bug at release

            MUGEN SOULS

            o
            Scrubbing minigame removed over 120 CGs removed. Basically censored extremely
            lazily. Excuses given over the years were many and varied, but some of them
            were “We wanted to appeal as much as possible to a wider
            demographic.” “The vocal minority can’t put a dent in our
            wallet.” “We find this content creepy.” “Unofficial ESRB
            rep indicated this title has potential for AO (it didn’t)”

            o
            Created new bugs and glitches not seen in the JP release

            o
            Massive lag during regular battles

            o Can
            fail an area load after a battle forcing you to restart from your previous save

            MUGEN
            SOULS Z

            o
            Scrubbing minigame removed, over 120 CGs removed. See entry for Mugen Souls

            o Elka
            introduced as the Hero of Water World when she’s the hero of the Fire World

            o
            Slumbering Boss battles cause freezes in Mugen Field

          • http://linkapics.tumblr.com/ Linka

            I’ll admit the Esty one was always a weird one, and really is the only name change thing I’m against, otherwise.

            AT2′s crash bugs are definitely bad, and I hope that the game will get fixed for any PSN releases.

            The Mugen Souls Z game freeze is bad. I won’t get into the scrubbing minigame for either entry.

            I’m gonna be honest that I have never experienced overheating or game crashes for either Witch and the Hundred Knight or Disgaea D2– especially the latter, which I kept in my system and bought day 1. I did have that HP glitch issue though, and the opening cutting off was annoying, but otherwise, I definitely did not hear anything about CPUs melting.

            It’s like I said, I do not deny that NISA could improve their quality– and it sounds like, at the least, they’re attempting to take more steps when it comes to game testing and so forth. I think a lot of companies are sorta getting lazy in that area especially, due to how normal patches have become, but that’s just me. Just, yeah. My priority is on stuff like bugs/crashes more than censorship.

          • Robert Cisneros

            i recomend for criminal girls doing what i will so you dont support the censorship but can get the game which is buy it used so no profits go to NISA and as for the witch and the hundred knights ive been kicked back to the cross media bar 3 times now and still cant advance in z because of the glitch

    • Yaro

      I dont know about you, but censorship of fiction is inexcusable in any medium to me. If you dont want to release a thing as the creator intended than you probably should leave it to someone who does.

  • Sachiko Shinozaki

    I thought NISA of America would change, but i was so wrong.
    Im happy that i will never support them again by buying their censored games. I will start buying the Japanese version of all the fanservice games.

    Hyped Dimension Neptunia will be the only game i will support from them now on…

    • Raztune

      You’re in luck, they haven’t got the HDN series anymore. IFI took it from them.

      • http://burnpsy.wordpress.com/ burnpsy

        You make it sound like people who jump the gun at censorship will be happy at that. See: The meritless complaints regarding Monster Monpiece.

        • Raztune

          Uh, no. I was responding to the guy who made the comment about HDN.

          • http://burnpsy.wordpress.com/ burnpsy

            Yes, the guy who’s mad at censoring and said he wouldn’t support NISA because of it. But IFI also censors.

            I made no mistake.

          • Raztune

            Why the fuck are you responding to me then?

          • http://burnpsy.wordpress.com/ burnpsy

            Because you were the one who mentioned IFI. I had no reason to respond to the guy you responded to – my message was aimed at you.

            If you don’t get how that makes sense, reread the conversation a few times. Don’t bother asking again if you still can’t get it.

      • Hyosuke575

        Oh, that’s great news to hear then. Maybe the localization will be similar to the original Japanese content then. I get kinda annoyed when they make Neptune to be even crazier than she already is. ESPECIALLY, when you listen to the Japanese audio and read the subtitles and can clearly see the difference between the two. Even if you’re not fluent in the language….

        • Raztune

          Yeah they made Noire a moody bitch as well.
          The only thing I dislike what IFI did is the fact they’re releasing it as digital-only in the EU. I fucking hate digital only releases.

    • shadowind

      And I’m sure that they’ll be shedding lots of tears because you won’t be buying their games any more… /sarcasm

  • NeptuniasBeard

    I get that censorship is censorship, but I am a man of context, and I always get a good laugh when I look at what people are actually fighting for.

    Bravely Default: Fight against the censorship of character in a chibi art style getting a swimsuit altered to be a little less risque.

    Monster Monpiece: Fight against the removal of certain cards (some of which were of girls no older than 10 physically) that the player would have to rub in a suggestive manner to “power it up”

    Criminal Girls: Fight against the censorship of punishment scenes, which is pretty much light hearted ryouna.

    And even that one game… Bullet Girls or something, people are getting pre-emptively wary about a potential localizer censoring the bits where you tie up and molest people. For… training purposes, of course.

    Don’t misunderstand, I’m not here to judge, I’m far from a saint in these matters (I’m planning on getting every Senran Kagura game). And I have my own things I fight against that others may look down on me for. (Like the removal of homosexual content). But I’m just saiyan, you can argue it’s just the principle of the whole thing, but I can’t help it, as the residential asexual pervert, but wonder if some of you are full of it, and are really just upset because you can’t get all your sexual jollies out of these games. Be honest boys and girls, it’s the internet

    • Yaro

      Well there arent many games that get censored for any other reason. Recently only Evil Withing is getting censored in japan, but thats not an issue because they can download a full gore DLC. So they get the full game regardless.

      But yeah its easy to yell at people who want their animu girls as developers intended, because it feels soooo good to act holier than thou. Preferably with a bible in one hand and a gun in the other.

    • Audie Bakerson

      “some of which were of girls no older than 10 physically”

      They sure as hell don’t look human, let alone like children, to me. I don’t think anyone in any corner of the globe who could see could ever fail to distinguish them from humans.

    • Brimfyre

      With Monster Monpiece, the young looking girls I can understand, but what about the fully adult one with chocolate sauce being dripped on her? Why was that removed?

      Witcher 2 has full frontal. I don’t get it.

      • X_Bacon

        And let’s not forget about Dekamori Senran Kagura. Lots of life and hometown AND chocolate, and will be released uncensored too.

      • NeptuniasBeard

        Dude (lady?), I don’t know. Maybe to make the loli looking censorship less obvious or something?

        I’m not really trying to justify it.

    • http://twitter.com/#!/Leafy_Cam Leafhopper

      Someone acting sane thinking before screaming “STOP DA CENSORSHIP” on siliconera? That’s new.

    • Lalum

      First they came for the loli JRPGs and I did not speak out, because I was not a loli JRPG fan. Then they came for other games I did not care for, and I did not speak out. Then they came for the games I do enjoy, and there was no one left to speak for me. I will argue censorship from Yakuza 3 to Panty Quest Underage Girl Adventures 5.

      • http://twitter.com/matty_125 matty

        I love Tom~

    • shadowind

      I agree with you there, my friend that some of these moaning minnies (as we say here in the UK) are full of bullshit!

  • Tarkovsky

    While I’m personally against the censoring of games, fact is that different countries and cultures have different rules and regulations when it comes to things like these. The Evil Within and Metal Gear Rising are 2 recent examples of games that are censored in Japan. South Park The Stick of Truth was also either censored or not released in many countries because of the contents in the game. I really respect NISA and their efforts for bringing over games to the West even though most of them are extremely niche titles.

    • AkuLord3

      Metal Gear Rising wasn’t really censored…i mean the white blood thing is from MGS4…while i heard that blah blah the red blood is better version of cyborg stuff but really the white blood fit better.

  • Liamv2

    So wait what are they taking out. Just the underaged girls stuff or more than that it doesn’t really make clear what’s changed. Or i’m just a moron and missed it. (Would not be the first time)

    • http://denpanosekai.blogspot.com denpanosekai

      Did you read the article at all?
      - adding extra fog to some scenes
      - removing japanese audio during said scenes

      • Liamv2

        So that’s it huh. Not much change then.

    • X_Bacon

      “They are modifying the amount of fog that remains in some scenes as well as removing the Japanese audio from those same scenes.”

      Don’t know about you being a moron but yeah, you did miss it. lol

  • DesmaX

    Well, I do remember Ghostlight having to censor their release of Agarest 2 because of certain European regulations… Europe is even more restrict when it comes to that sort of stuff, so I can’t blame them Even though I’d rather them publish any otehr game than this… but there’s not many games that they can get, so what do I know?

    Anyway, this thread should get fun, so let me get some popcorn

    • http://linkapics.tumblr.com/ Linka

      I did see someone point out before that part of the problem might be that NISA has slimmer pickings than normal, so they had to dig a little deeper. We might’ve not gotten this game otherwise.

    • Crazy_O

      Some countries yes – the Pegi rating of most games with sexual content is usually much lower than the ESRB ratings.

      I don’t know why they care that much though – it’s no problem to release it in english only and in the countries that agree with the PEGI ratings. Don’t release it where it might have problems, people there are used to import anyway.

    • cgkt55

      No, it wasn’t the board that overreacted but Ghostlight. They only had to change a term but they removed stuff/images of a character unnecessarily. Europe is much more ok with sexual content than US. Europe is more strict when it comes to violence.
      I don’t really think that removing voices are “minor” changes. But whatever, not going to buy this game censored. If I really want it, I can still import. So, I’m fine.

      • DesmaX

        Well, Ghostlight did handle that poorly (Especially by not telling people that it was censored)

    • Sentsuizan_93

      Yup. Fiona had her minigame restricted to Generation 3 in the EU version. Didn’t stop me from getting the platinum trophy for it~
      Also, I would like some popcorn too.

  • Andrew A

    Just an FYI, but NISA never went to the ESRB and asked whether or not the game would get an AO. They didn’t do this with the Mugen Souls games either; they self censored everything beforehand. if you honestly think that Mugen Souls or Criminal Girls would have gotten an AO, you’ve been lied to and I’m sorry.

    If XSeed had no issue releasing Senran Kagura over here, NISA would have no issue bringing over Criminal Girls unscathed. If NISA feels this game was too risque, maybe they shouldn’t be localizing it in the first place.

    Here’s an accurate sneak peak of what undoubtedly will be Criminal Girl’s fate in the US: http://youtu.be/kyCJmiorP6g

    Enjoy.

    • Slickyslacker

      Upvoting this so it gets more exposure.

      Where did you get this from?

      • Yaro

        Its obviously fake, dont be gullible. I dont like censorship but I also dont like fake propaganda. Be careful.

        • Slickyslacker

          The punishment scene is “removed” (surely skipped), and this is still the JP version of the game…

          …so we’re back where we started. :/

          • X_Bacon

            It was just the video that was edited, it’s not like that in the game.

    • Guest

      They said they’re keeping the punishment stuff, minus the moaning, so this video is crap. =P

      • Robert Cisneros

        thats the extra steam they said they were giving

    • Bob Slim

      I find this really funny but I dont think it will be this way lol

    • http://linkapics.tumblr.com/ Linka

      I’d say you shouldn’t post fake videos that will mislead people, but to be honest, if anyone actually believed that video after thinking about it, I’d feel sad.

      • Andrew A

        My bad. My intention wasn’t to trick people, It was just more of a “this is what I expect NISA to do.” I made it when they first announced they were going to densely fog up the screen and cut the audio and this was just how I imagined it’d be like. Sorry for the confusion, guys.

        • http://linkapics.tumblr.com/ Linka

          I think it was you saying “accurate sneak peak” that would confuse folks. Might be good to edit your comment to clarify it, but that’s just me.

    • SupaPhly

      should have used a clip from the “white piggu go home” video instead of the solid purple :P

      EDIT: or an image that’s similar to the crying koala censorship on the australian version of south park stick of truth

    • MSJ

      lol

  • Yaro

    Meanwhile in KT land, Ar Nosurge is released with no censorship whatsoever, while also featuring flat characters in even more risque situations.

    Its not as bad as I feared but I have troubles actually trusting what NISA says. I do want to play this game tho, will have to decide yet after seeing the actual result.

    Also why isnt uncensored DLC an option? Like Evil Within? I would pay for that, its a decent compromise IMO.

    • Guest

      That’s because Ar NoSurge doesn’t have objectable stuff like this game does(no, the characters don’t moan in pleasure during the purification rituals, and the ones who are in those rituals aren’t drawn like lolis). =P

      • Yaro

        Well I heard plenty of moans and loli characters in underwear in atelier series and previous ar tonelicos. Those were uncensored too.

        So…yeah I stand by my point.

      • http://linkapics.tumblr.com/ Linka

        I think a lot of people miss the difference between what might be in this game and games like Mugen Souls, and what might be in games like Ar Nosurge.

      • dark-kyon
  • Bob Slim

    Im ok with the little changes they made, I know some people gonna still be mad but I dont care, Its better then what they did with mugen souls removing the whole mini game and cg with it. So I will be getting it when it come out I understand nisa

    • Yaro

      I think thats exactly the point. The censorship is so minimal, is it actually necessary? Couple sploitches of steam and no moans suddenly make it ok?

      Im skeptical, but its true. Its not as bad as I thought and I will probably buy the game at some point, it does look fun.

      • http://linkapics.tumblr.com/ Linka

        You’ll be entirely amazed at what the line is when it comes to ratings boards. The steam parts might not sound too big, but it does help obscure the image, sorta like a mosaic censor would. And voices being taken out are fairly big too– depending on the voice acting, some things can sound very realistic and can really ruffle a rating boards’ feathers.

        • Yaro

          Unless you work for ESRB or PEGI I can’t take anything you say as evidence.

          There is a copy pasta circulating, with an XSEED employee explaining the situation with rating boards better than I could and it runs contrary to what you are saying. The restrictions are nowhere near THIS strict. Senran Kagura being case in point.

          • http://linkapics.tumblr.com/ Linka

            I suppose. I’m taking a lot of this from my my opinion is seeing, so you’re more than welcome to disregard it.

            But you can’t deny that these are the changes that /are/ being made, regardless.

          • Yaro

            Sure they are being made, Im not denying that, Im saying those changes are not necessary and NISA is just self censoring themselves. For reasons I dont think a localizing company should have (they are not devs).

          • http://linkapics.tumblr.com/ Linka

            Like you said, they’re not devs. The ones actually making these changes, as in the programming itself, are the original developers.

            Much as it might either be self-censorship or otherwise, you can’t ignore that the ones who made the game in the first place are agreeing to it and handling it.

          • Yaro

            NISA telling them what “needs” to be done isnt the same thing as devs coming up with it. Kadokawa kept close eye on their demon gaze (published by NISA) and that one is not censored, and features characters that could be considered lolis and various other females in a fan service situations. That game is PEGI 12 in EU and T for Teen in US.

          • http://linkapics.tumblr.com/ Linka

            Hmmm, I guess the main thing to consider though is what the line of fanservice is? I haven’t gotten to Demon Gaze yet (I have a very big backlog of mainly RPGs, so it’s hard to get through), so I can’t make a statement about that unless if I looked up specific scenes about it.

          • Yaro

            Its not as gratuitous and there is nothing akin to interactive punishment scenes, that has to be said. But I seriously doubt those scenes would raise the game from 12 to AO.

            I can recommend that game if you like first person dugeon crawlers, its really good. (and dual audio ofc, thats one thing I have to give NISA credit for)

          • http://linkapics.tumblr.com/ Linka

            That’s a sorta difference that I mean, in this sense. It wouldn’t be censored, because there’s nothing that could be considered gratuitous. It’s all when it comes to it being “gratuitous” that you start having problems. But again, I can’t accurately discuss this point without playing the game and seeing for myself what it involves.

            I do enjoy some First Person dungeon crawlers, yes. I keep meaning to play more of EO on that line, but again, big backlog. I’ll keep in mind at least to pick up Demon Gaze otherwise.

          • Yaro

            Backlog is real. I know that all too well. Anyway thanks for a civilised discussion. I think I will call it for now. Have a good day.

          • http://linkapics.tumblr.com/ Linka

            Thank you, too. Have a good day yourself.

      • CharIotteV

        Removing moans makes sense… they are quite erotic sounding. Personally, I’m hoping the censoring with the steam is done in a way that makes it more erotic than it actually is similar to how bubble censors are done. That’d be funny to me.

        • http://linkapics.tumblr.com/ Linka

          Or maybe like how Fire Emblem: Awakening’s censorship of Tharja in one scene actually made her look naked?

        • Yaro

          Luckily for me I dont care about the moans at all, but it still feels unnecessary to me. And you raise a good point about the steam, will have to wait and see the final product. Im still not blindly boycotting the thing but I sure was close. (poor mugen souls)

        • Meteo

          removing moans doesn’t make sense at all. One of the main selling points of this game is the erotic parts.

    • shadowind

      I’m one of those who definitely couldn’t give a fuck about what a bunch of temper throwing brats think! If it was something major, then that’s understandable, but the removal of sexy moans and added fog? All I can say is that these people are seriously in need of a damn life, in all honesty!

  • Audie Bakerson

    Times “making the game more appealing to a larger audience” has done something other than lose the dedicated fanbase and gained nothing:

    That’s the full list.

    Protip NISA: Don’t use PR lines that have mocked and despised openly for years to justify your inanity.

  • nekolife

    Good thing we get to signal with our wallets that we don’t want censored games regardless of their attempt to justify it.

  • Yagami Mao

    wooo! ^^

  • Nu Blitz

    Oh man I thought the censor was gonna be way bigger. Glad it’s just a bit of fog

    • X_Bacon

      Personally, I don’t mind the fog so much as the audio removal.

  • DanijoEX ♬ the Cosmic Owl

    At least, NISA is trying to keep it as close to it as they can.

  • X_Bacon

    After getting this out of the way, and this being NISA, the next thing that worries me most right now is the extent of the script changes.

    • Yaro

      And possible game breaking bugs, since they are changing the shape of the game…again. (like MGZ and WTHK)

      • Maksim Tsirulnik

        All the bugs that have been in their recent games have been occurring only on their PS3 titles. Since “Disgaea D2″, you will see that every PS3 title since then has had a bug (Well, except for “Battle Princess of Arcadias” which, at least for now, seems to be bug free and that’s also a PS3 game).

        Every other title not on the PS3 (Like on the PSVita) has gone bug free.

        Either way, this problem is being addressed.

        Houk (Employee of NISA):
        “We have an in-house QA team which coordinates with the Japanese developers, and we also work with an external testing company for various things. We do spend a significant amount of time testing our games, and the fact is that with the recent issues we’ve had, none of these issues were present during debug. As in, we did the things that were causing these issues for end users, and they didn’t cause issues for us. Why that is exactly I’m not sure, since we’re not programmers. Since we’ve had these issues, we’re looking into ways to improve or modify our testing cycle to try and account for these things, so hopefully it won’t be an issue in the future.”

        http://nisamerica.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=14964&p=792206#p792206

        Also, this has nothing to do with changing the “shape” of the game. “Disgaea D2″ had a bug when nothing was cut out from it.

        The problem here is that code do tend to be very fickle and doing anything with them (like replacing text codes to show English instead of Japanese) can cause possible problems. The issue here is that the errors are somehow getting across undetected on their testing-kits.

        • Yaro

          That is encouraging, but also disheartening in the sense that those game breaking bugs arent even being fixed right now. Or at least thats what the text implies.

          • Maksim Tsirulnik

            There was a patch for “Disgaea D2″, but the effectiveness of it seems to be completely random. For some users, it fixed the bug. For other users, it did nothing.

            Then there’s the patch for “Mugen Souls Z” which should be coming out soon. It’s already been submitted to SONY a couple days ago. It should be releasing somewhat soon.

            For “The Witch & The Hundred Knight”, I have no idea. With the complete and utter randomness of the bug, it’s near impossible to emulate for testing purposes. This makes it only harder to find and see what is wrong exactly. News-wise, there really isn’t much to say. No one knows if a patch is even being made at this point. Last I heard, someone was checking it out, but that was a while ago. Houk, the NISA-employee most in touch with users in the forum, says that he didn’t work under that project so he’s out of the loop as well.

        • Robert Cisneros

          ehem extensive testing is such a lie i do not know where to start lets take mugen souls z after playing it for 4 hours at 4 hr 30 min i found a literally game breaking glitch of the slumbering boss causing the system to freeze and now i can not advance in the mugen field to get the true end, no offense but extensive testing is a bit much

  • Crazy_O

    Could you rerelease it uncensored in Japan with the english translation? Most likely not possible – I know, but I would import it asap.

  • HellMuT

    I call BS, but whatever nisa.

  • http://mahdrills.com Mahdrills

    I wasn’t even very interested in this game when I heard about it, but dang have I been hearing a lot of unfavorable thing about NISA’s practices. Game breaking bugs, poor translations, and now this censorship issue. Now as much as I appreciate a western company that devotes itself to bringing games here from the east, I’m hesitant to buy if I’m not getting the same experience.

    • Tyler Beale

      Poor translations? Game breaking bugs? Explain. I’ve never seen any fuck-ups in the Neptunia games (really, the only ones I buy from NISA, I just realized) other than half the scenes being muted.

      • http://twitter.com/matty_125 matty

        Rhapsody DS had a couple annoying bugs. Not sure about translations, as I don’t speak Japanese.

        In reality, NISA was on *really* shaky grounds with their localizing efforts years ago, but have since become consistent and solid in my eyes. Any criticisms I see that they get now reminds me of what could have been if something didn’t whip them straight (probably sales?).

        • http://linkapics.tumblr.com/ Linka

          Rhapsody DS was such a big mess– but I think it was really the biggest mess they had all things considering. Which is such a shame, if the game had been handled better on any level, we might have a much different story for the Marl Kingdom series.

          Otherwise, I do agree their stuff has become more consistent otherwise.

          • http://twitter.com/matty_125 matty

            Big mess, indeed. I’m still a little PO about how they advertised the extra chapters on their official site, but ended up not being in the game. Not to mention the one reviewer who claimed to have played those parts in English — I still have no idea who was telling the truth in that incident.
            Yeah, it took a long while for me to forgive what NISA did to my beloved Marl series, but I think I’m past it.

            Oh, and I hear about the bugs in the Gust games they released were bad, too.

          • http://linkapics.tumblr.com/ Linka

            Yeah, though to be honest, I think the bugs in the Gust games have been /worse/ now since Koei Tecmo took over.

            I’ve had numerous times where my game will actually crash in Totori+, Meruru+, and especially Rorona+ (where I have had three game crashes, and one full system crash during my first playthrough of the Vita one– and a friend of mine had a similar game crash at one of the same spots I did.)

      • http://burnpsy.wordpress.com/ burnpsy

        There were crash bugs in Mugen Souls Z and The Witch and the Hundred Knight. While avoidable, in the case of Mugen Souls Z, it made getting the true ending harder than it should have been (you have to save repeatedly and hope you don’t randomly get the crash).

        They’re patching the one in Mugen Souls Z, but not the other one.

        Honestly, though, their localizations are mostly okay.

        • Tyler Beale

          I’m curious to know if it’s in the Japanese version as well. ‘Cause if it is, then it’s really CH’s ballgame.

          • http://burnpsy.wordpress.com/ burnpsy

            No, the Japanese release did not have the bug.

      • notentirelythere

        NISA games read like artless anime sub-group scripts.

      • Wappuli

        Haven’t yet encountered any game breaking bugs myself either.
        As for translations, Disgaeas have been OK, but the first Neptunia was filled with bad translation. And no, calling them just “script changes” don’t make it any better.

        • Tyler Beale

          I never played the 1st Neptunia so I wouldn’t know. Though the English dub was fantastic IMO. (and I mean the voices themselves, not the way NISA has handled it in mk2 and Victory)

      • http://mahdrills.com Mahdrills

        I don’t have much personal experience with NISA myself (though I am planning on getting Danganronpa 2 when its out) I remember reading a list of games NISA had localized with a lot of the glitches that they had to patch (or never fixed) and their translation blunders. Their most recent game Mugen Souls Z (which actually came under criticism of censoring as well) has a bug (if you do some googling) that causes a pretty major freeze. Also, doing some more Googling there was some problems people were having with The Witch and the Hundred Knight shutting down on them unexpectedly.

        As far as translation quality, again it’s something I’ve mostly heard. Like I remember there was some criticism over Danganronpa’s translation a while back. I also think I remember something about memes being used and people being upset.

        I just found this. It was an editorial written back in 2009 about NISA talking about some of the same stuff I hear it being accused of today. http://www.rpgfan.com/editorials/2009/03-01.html

        So yeah.. These guys have a bit of a track record that doesn’t seem to be getting any better.

  • http://nichegamer.net/ bf313

    Definitely not as bad as I was expecting, I can deal with a bit of removed audio and some extra fog. Glad that the game is coming over regardless and happy to buy it day 1!

  • Raw

    I guess it’s a good compromise, although muting the scenes is probably make the minigames more annoying.

    • Tyler Beale

      As though the CPUs and their friends weren’t muted enough….

      I’m glad they actually fixed that in Neptunia PP in the main game, but in Viewer Mode, the hello/goodbye and alarm voice clips are there, but when I tap them, all I see are flapping mouths. What’s worse, is that IFfy and Compa are completely muted, as are the 1 or 2 events in the main game that involve them.

      Changing the audio language fixes those problems, but I want to hear my lovely Noire squeal in English, dammit!!

      • Stalemeat

        Were the lack of voices in Neptunia PP’s case more of a budget issue?

  • Sentsuizan_93

    So it’s not exactly as bad as many made it out to be.
    Maybe releasing a voice pack as DLC might help for those who want the voices in the minigame, but really, the whole situation on the forums feels like everyone making a big deal out of spilled milk.
    Ironic thing is, when this game was announced to be edited, everyone made a big deal out of it without having any knowledge of what exactly has changed and therefore sparked up a row on the forums, assuming the worst.
    Now this has come to light, and well… It’s not as bad as the majority made it out to be. Sure the lack of the moans/voices is off-putting for some and the added steam as well, but again, we don’t have any samples of the final product.
    Personally, I’ll still be keeping an eye on this game, but throwing assumptions at this stage feels premature.

    • Yaro

      Thats the most reasonable attitude I think. But the worries over the extent of censorship were absolutely warranted. I agree its not as bad and its even acceptable, but I still dont like the idea of censorship of fiction.

  • doubleO7

    Ok, not as bad as I thought. So just slightly more fog and no moaning and sexy talk in Japanese during the punishment scenes? No big deal. Still buying it.

  • Meteo

    Sometimes, I wish they don’t release these games in the West. Its already such a niche market and they are removing many things that would have appealed to that audience. All that’s left over is an even smaller market thats okay with the censorship. Then people will just moan and complain about how this is now just a watered down version of what it should have been. There’s basically no good that can come from this, other than a few extra bucks for NIS.

    • http://twitter.com/#!/Leafy_Cam Leafhopper

      Basically that’s what I feel. I don’t give a damn about these kinds of games of “Do a thing, get some lewd” but, why even bother localizing at all if you are going to take out the stuff that appeals to the people that like these kinds of games anyway?

  • butts

    This entire response is bullcrap to the highest degree and just another case of NISA trying to pull the wool over the eyes of the ignorant people who still continue to support them for some ungodly reason.

    The whole “working with the ratings board” thing is a straight out lie. Not once for any of their censored releases did they contact either the ESRB or PEGI with questions or concerns about the censored content, which means that they censored stuff entirely at their own discretion. Even a rep from XSEED confirmed that a lot of stuff they censored in previous games most likely would have been allowed to slide and wouldn’t have pushed the games higher than an M or Pegi 16 rating. It’s incredibly hard for a game to actually get an AO rating but instead of trying to “keep games as close to the original” like they claim, they just go ahead and censor stuff anyway without actually trying to confirm if it needs to be censored. If you’re going to give up before even trying then why even bother bringing stuff over in the first place?

    Further more, the whole idea of censoring things to try and make games appeal to a wider audience is incredibly foolish and never works. The people who are interested in these kind of games in the first place are going to want them untouched from their original versions. Censoring stuff only drives those people away and ultimately does little to draw in new customers. Games like these cater to a specific niche, and no matter how much you censor them it’s not suddenly going to make them more popular with the casual buyer or encourage someone who wasn’t interested in them in the first place to buy them on a whim. They’re alienating an already small fanbase for a flimsy reason instead of trying to guarantee the sales they would have gotten had they left stuff untouched.

    Aside from censorship, NISA has always had a shaky history with their games in terms of translation and localizations. I’m sure people remember the famous crashing fiascos with games like Ar Tonelico 1 and Mana Khemia 1/2. Most of their releases are full of bugs that they never acknowledge or go back and fix, leaving people to just deal with them. This is unacceptable when a lot of those bugs can lead to game crashes or prevent you from progressing. Along with that their translation quality of games are subpar at best and their quality control is downright awful at times. Even more recent games released have untranslated text in them or things just plain translated wrong. In the lesser cases unneeded “jokes” and dialogue are added to scenes to try and make them more humorous even if the tone is supposed to be serious at the moment. In the more serious cases entire character personalities and intents are completely changed and their dialogue isn’t anywhere close to how it was in the original. Again, a lot of these translation are simply done by the translation team’s discretion, meaning they add in stuff that they personally think is funny even if it ruins an entire scene or character. This is a terrible practice for a company and there’s no excuse why they’ve been able to keep getting away from it.

    I’ll be honest. At one point in the past I did support NISA and was thankful they were bringing games over. The Disgaea series, Phantom Brave, Makai Kindom, and Soul Nomad were all games I enjoyed immensely and bought day one. As time went on and they continued to localize more games, however, it started to become clear just how much they don’t seem to care as a company and how often they go against the very philosophies they try to use to defend themselves when questioned. At one time they were the only people bringing over games like this so you had no choice but to support them, but now that their are other companies like XSEED and Koei Tecmo actually bringing stuff over and doing actually quality localizations, there’s honestly no reason to keep supporting NISA for their bad practices and decisions at this point.

    Finally, to the people who are going “oh this is no big deal” and “well at least they’re trying”, you’re missing the point. They aren’t trying. You’re giving your money to a company who has been pointed out to be outright lying by several other companies when it comes to their decisions. You’re paying for a product that has been needlessly censored more than required based on the company’s own personal judgement and not any actual advice or law. You’re also paying for a shoddy translation full of unneeded jokes, dialogue, and name changes based on the personal feelings of the mediocre translation team. You as a customer don’t deserve a product handled that badly and there’s no reason to defend it. NISA isn’t the only one bringing games like this over anymore so there’s no reason to keep clinging to them instead of hoping that other companies claim certain titles first. They’ve only been able to keep getting away with this because of people with this battered housewife “I’ll take what I can get” mentality. There’s no reason you should keep putting up with this and NISA will keep doing it as long as they think they can keep getting away with it.

    I don’t know if I’ll get flagged or banned or whatever for this rant, but I needed to get it off my chest. I did not mean to come across as insulting to anyone individually, but I needed to get this out. With just a little research you can see the extent to which NISA has bungled translations in the past and why their “reasons” for having to censor things are complete and outright lies. Like I said, I too used to support them in the past, but in current times there’s absolutely no reason to keep putting up with their bad business choices. I probably haven’t dissuaded those who are set on buying it anyway no matter what either, but to those of you looking in from the outside or are on the fence, remember that you DO have a choice and it doesn’t have to be with NISA.

    Butts out.

    • shadowind

      After reading your post, I wonder if you’re one of those type of people who believes in the existence of the Illuminati by any chance because of your conspiracy theory over NISA’s censorship.

      • butts

        What conspiracy theory? Everything I have brought up in terms of their localizations and censorship are completely true, not jaded opinions.

        It’s a fact that they hadn’t submitted any of their final products to the ESRB for considerations before going ahead with censoring them.

        It’s a fact that most of their releases are full of bugs and crashes, some of which are potentially gamebreaking. If you want a list I can even post one.

        It’s a fact that they sometimes leave in untranslated text or translates things completely wrong.

        It’s a fact that they add needless fluff text and jokes to scenes that sometimes ruin any emotional impact or seriousness they may have had.

        It’s a fact they change names just for the hell of it sometimes or just to make more needless jokes.

        It’s a fact that their translations are mediocre at best and downright unacceptable at worst, changing entire personalities and scenes from their original dialogue.

        Every single one of these have evidence to back them up, which I will gladly post if you want me to. So unless you can point out something from those that just isn’t true, then please be quiet. It’s clear you’re a NISA fan and want to support the company but unless you can bring in an unbiased view to dispute those claims with evidence then don’t jump in to mindlessly defend them.

        • shadowind

          I’m not being a apologist for NISA or anything like that and I know a lot about their mistakes in the past, but to me, your rant does come across as being a bit too much “conspiracy theory” to me and I refuse to apologise for saying so.

    • MillerKun

      I’ll agree with you NISA needs to fix their bugs for the games they release.They need more staff members that fix these sort of things.

    • http://www.thejaystack.com/ Jon Stachewicz

      that’s a lot of words to write about a bad game

    • Robert Cisneros

      You forgot about Mugen Souls Z and the game breaking glitch…. ne way my comment:
      “We apologize for this situation and we hope that you will stand by us”

      i think this sums up NISA mindset they just have high hopes that things will work out, i find it funny as soon as KT said that the LE of No Surge is coming from NISA they got bombarded with is it going to be censored and actually responded with no it wont is telling of what their hopes will get them, and lets look at the change to this game more critically maybe they will add gags of different variety to each minigame to make it make sense as to why they dont speak, id like a rope gag myself also lets look at the other thing they said they will alter the story content so im guessing the teenage prostitution is gonna be rewriten and changed if not removed entirely. I honestly do not want the game anymore i had even forgotten about it til the announcement that it was coming over then i heard NISA was localizing it and went …………….. damnit. i really hope this game sell horribly and i have never wished that of any game while i did not like the censorship in monpiece as it was arbitrary and just not needed i really did not see it as a means to not get the game since i like card games and they are hard to come by on systems so i gave it a pass, but now i have seen what this has actually done and i am regretful of my purchase as well as my purchase of the original mugen souls new, i bought the second one used so NISA couldn’t take my money just gamestop, for at least I can support gamestop.

  • Varnes

    Well good for them finally putting out an official statement, ill be picking this up for sure now

  • landlock

    Cool. So there not removing anything but the voices for the minigames. Great nothing of value was lost then. Happy days.

  • mega jew

    Meanwhile, XSEED continue to be based.

    • Shippoyasha

      The localization scene could afford 3 or 4 more Xseeds around. Or maybe Japanese publishers can localize their own games and spare this headache of the middle man process.

  • Xenoss

    This is just a game, censored or not (and I’m sure NISA did their best).

    The real concern is the direction American culture had been headed. Less and less open, more and more censorship. Interestingly while the law and the constitution gives you the right to freedom of speech, it is the people themselves who became the source of censorship. So while the law doesn’t arrest you, the mob burns you at the stake (figuratively speaking).

  • Stalemeat

    This censorship is not bad actually. A little fog and a little silence, big deal. NISA really tried hard to provide very little censorship, because it was either this or no game at all. If people still find this censorship to be unforgivable or something like that, they should just buy the Japanese version… you can do that you know.

    • Atwa

      They tell you, its this or nothing. Though there are games far more risky than this that makes it over without censoring.

      • Laith Rem

        Name another game that has BDSM as a gameplay mechanic that came in the States.

        • Robert Cisneros

          Saints Row and GTA have missions invovling it so gameplay mechanic there and then we have Manhunt which has it galore also some can count Bayonetta but i wouldnt

  • MrTyrant

    Still voices are important but I can deal with this now.

  • Michael Richardson

    OK, if that’s the extent of the censorship, I’m game. Hopefully the fog increase isn’t too much, but I understand getting rid of all the Japanese moaning.

  • CrimsonDX

    Looks like I won’t be getting this one. Definitely about time I actually learn Japanese….

  • Dewey Defeats Truman

    I will never understand this idea that SOME censorship is okay just because it’s not going all out. Censorship is one of those things in life where an all-or-nothing stance is truly justified, I believe.

    And besides, I remembering hearing once that if a game is only released digitally, a rating from the ESRB, or PEGI, or what have you is not required to sell it. If I’m wrong, I apologize, but while it’s hardly the perfect solution, I personally think many players would be far happier having a digital copy of a game in-tact than a physical copy of a game with ANY cut or changed content.

    And the line “We know that censoring a game would lose just as many fans as it may potentially bring in.” I don’t understand that logic at all. This is not a game that will ever sell as much as, say, Bravely Default. The kind of person that is going to buy this game is most likely highly informed of the product, and the kind of person most likely to be upset by these changes. I genuinely can’t see this kind of action helping them at all.

    Lastly though I find issue with the fact that, in the past, they completely cut a minigame from Mugen Souls. A minigame that was very similar to another one in a game that came over to the states intact. Between these two things I honestly just have a hard time trusting them when they say that such removed parts of games are necessary or even useful to avoid an AO rating (which I can not possibly imagine this could ever receive, after all there is no explicit nudity or the like.) I’m trying to not just accuse them of lying but I do genuinely believe right now that they simply have a personal issue with this content and don’t want it in their games. In that case, it would be best for everyone if they simply didn’t localize it. After all, the Playstation Vita is region free.

    • http://linkapics.tumblr.com/ Linka

      On the level of “you don’t need a rating if it’s digital”, it’s wrong.

      At the very least, if they want to sell this on the Playstation Network/SEN, the game does need to be rated. And PSN/SEN has it’s own limitations.

      The digital platform you might be thinking of is Steam, where many independent games will not have ratings attached to them. For instance: Terraria. Terraria has no rating on Steam, but it is rated T on PSN.

      • Dewey Defeats Truman

        Alright, that is my bad and I apologize for getting my information wrong. That said, I still hold to my opinion that the people interested in this game that will be far more upset and refuse to buy it is larger than any number of potential new customers or those who aren’t concerned.

  • kbza

    If xseed can bring senran kagura uncensored, why can’t nisa do the same for CG?
    For me game censored = no buy

    • ThatGuy3190_7

      In Senran Kagura, there is the matter of their clothes being torn apart. Risque but harmless. In Criminal Girls, there is the matter of punishing and harming girls with sexual pleasure from both the girls and the person who is causing the action with almost near nudity or sexual positions.

      • Dewey Defeats Truman

        The keyword there is “almost.”

        In Senran Kagura: Shinovi Versus, the characters can become completely nude (though without anything important showing due to it being censored even in the original Japanese release) and that’s still coming over unscathed.

        • Laith Rem

          Acts of sexual nature are way higher than nudity in the rating boards. Also quasi-pedophilia and all that.

      • British_Otaku

        As of Dekamori Senran Kagura (Nyotaimori is a go) and Shinovi Versus (completely nude characters), and even portions of Senran Kagura Burst which are brief. They can’t be far behind at all.

        • ThatGuy3190_7

          I’m aware of the fan service of the series (didn’t say games because I don’t want to spoil myself on as I have yet to play the first Senran Kagura and am interested in playing upcoming releases), but I don’t think any girls, if not most, enjoy being punished and harmed for sexual pleasure, at least they most likely do not openly show it or is known to the player.

          • British_Otaku

            Sticking to the first installment/Burst (the only I’ve played), Haruka seems to enjoy being peeked on (the changing room), manipulates and arguably tortures male subordinates which she keeps hidden (the story) and seems to enjoy being hit to the point of losing clothes while other characters are more clearly frustrated no matter what poses or camera angles are played with.

            We can also mess with the other characters in the changing room by blowing up skirts or… experimenting with the physics to get a few responses.

            (Off Topic: You know what? The Wonderful 101 does it too… Wonder Pink says “More Vorkkie” when you have her as the leader while taking damage from a frequent rival boss in the game…. And both Wonderful 101 and Senran Kagura Burst are rated T >_>)

            I highlighted the fact that the subordinates were male, but wish to know what difference it really makes especially as I have a case for Haruka, one of the playable characters as well.

            Given that all of the Senran Kagura games which only go further and further are making it over without missing a thing… I can’t really see NISA’s case.

  • Junko Enoshima

    You guys are all. missing. the. point.

    Games like Senran Kagura feature characters who are visibly at or past legal age, while Criminal Girls feature characters who look like children. It’s nearly pedophilia.

    • kbza

      What about Mirai?

    • Dewey Defeats Truman

      From all the images I’ve seen precisely one of them looks anything like a child, and even then I could make that same argument for Senran Kagura with Mirai.

      • Bob Slim

        Even though Mirai look like a kid shes not shes older then she looks. Shes older then the pink hair girl by a year who dont look like a kid

        • Dewey Defeats Truman

          And Etna is over a thousand years old. The concerns here are about body type rather than actual age. There’s a reason Senran Kagura omits the ages (the only censorship or anything like it in the game, mind you).

          • Bob Slim

            True enough it could be a game with all the characters. looking like kids and, They 18 and older people will still throw a fit about it

        • Aesma

          Doesn’t the same rule apply here then? The girls in Criminal Girls aren’t really kids by ‘age’.

          • Bob Slim

            True I dont even know what there age is. People just have there opinion on what there age is and. Since they are dead it really doesnt matter what there age is. If you dead you cant grow anymore and thats what this is

          • Aesma

            Oh well… there is a reason why dead people are marked as ‘deceased’ instead of their ages after all…

            Nothing we can do about it then.

      • Sheyenne

        I can’t make an argument about all of them lol

    • butts

      All of the girls in this are past legal age as well and only one of the characters in this could really pass as an underage child. And it’s funny you mention SK when Mirai visibly resembles a child, which is more obvious especially when put next to the rest of the cast. Agarest 2, which had a bath minigame featuring several underage looking characters, was fine as well.

      The only one missing the point is you. The most they would have had to do was remove the actual ages stated like XSEED did with the SK ages to get by.

    • DesmaX

      But they are 8 thousand years old, way past age of consent.

      duh

    • CrusaderEsper

      Let me introduce you to Mirai: http://i.imgur.com/dYKPR32.jpg She’s the one on the left and she’s 14 years old. Drawings are NOT people. There is nothing pedophilic about it.

      • Bob Slim

        Shes 16 not 14

        • CrusaderEsper

          Actually we’re both wrong, she’s 15. http://i.imgur.com/fx3HFOn.png

          • Bob Slim
          • CrusaderEsper

            That’s the sequel. The image I posted is from the first game’s website. http://www.marv.jp/special/game/3ds/kagura/character/mirai.html

          • Bob Slim

            I see but what about the pink hair girl is she 14 then lol

          • Sheyenne

            She is 15 in SKB

          • Sheyenne

            Still she jail bait lol

          • Bob Slim

            Mabye to you but not to me im around that age
            To me 16 is older enough

          • Sheyenne

            Also that base on their aged and our aged. You might be younger than me.

            I’m 28. So anything under 18 is illegal, Where you might be 18 or a little older or younger and I see that fine lol

          • Bob Slim

            I see what you mean im 18

          • Sheyenne

            Yeah, but still this games isn’t bad as GTA games.

          • Bob Slim

            Ante that the true and GTA games be getting censored in japan too

          • Sheyenne

            I rather have GTA censored over here lol I think Japanese doesn’t take kindly to to much blood and stupid killing?

          • Bob Slim

            I agree lol

        • Sheyenne

          she is 15

    • Edgar Nieves

      I’ll tell NISA this.

    • Reki Honoo

      Exactly! At first I was mad as to why they would censor it, but then I actually thought about it, and it made sense. I would rather have the game come over, and have some censorship, instead of it not coming over at all.

    • shadowind

      Sad to say that people like CrusaderEsper either don’t understand why these decisions are made or they don’t give a damn.

      • Dewey Defeats Truman

        Considering the little girl in his image is in a game coming over soon completely uncensored that is 100 times more sexual in content than the original game I think it is safe to say the issue has less to do with any laws and more of a worry about offending people.

    • Sheyenne

      When a girl is 16 or under is that legal aged? That’s jail bait to me.

      Asuka is 16
      Hibari is 15
      Mirai is 15 (the flat chest girl)

      Tell me when does a 15 year old is legal?

      Anyway, SK does have a small censorship in it. They never tell the character aged. To be honest, I believe censorship isn’t bad or good. Also CG look like chibi which they might not be the aged they look like.

    • Shippoyasha

      To be fair, all you ever get to in Criminal Girls is spanking some girl at most. Some of the older characters in the roster has some skeevy pasts, but that’s really about it.

      I do think it’s fair to say that the characters really do look young, but mostly it’s because of the artstyle. Even near adult characters in the game looks very cutesy.

    • otakumike

      Plus, YouTube exists for a reason. To those that say you’re missing out on a major part of the game…is it really that fun to abuse little girls? O.o

      I’m just angry because I hear that this is a poor game in it’s own right. I don’t want to play crap games just to get to these minigames. Hentai has spoiled me anyway lol

  • CrusaderEsper

    I just don’t even know why they bother. All they do is alienate their already dwindling fanbase further with these constant censors. I know several people that used to be fanatical NISA fans and bought every title they released that have sworn off the company forever. People saw Criminal Girls in Japan and thought “Well, that’s probably never getting localized” and moved on. NISA would have lost no respect by not bringing it over at all. The same goes for Mugen Souls and the sequel. If you feel that a game won’t pass muster without censorship, don’t bother. All you do is anger your fans.

    • Wtv

      Yeah, no, sorry. Still want to play Mugen Souls with a stupid side content that would be boring anyway censored.

      Don’t make it sound like you know what everyone wants.

    • Yuuki

      Don’t you think your overreacting,just a little bit?

  • shadowind

    I hate censorship as much as the next person, but all you whiners out there have to understand why they’re doing this. If you want to blame anyone, blame the ratings people and the soccer mom’s.

    As far as I’m concerned, I’m still going to buy the damn game regardless of what a bunch of spoilt entitled brats think. If you want to buy it uncensored, just import the Japanese version instead, problem solved! ^_^

    • Dewey Defeats Truman

      It’s hard to blame “the ratings people” when they haven’t contacted them yet (I would have to assume, regardless of what they say, simply due to the fact that the game isn’t very far in the localization process right now.) and it’s even harder to blame “soccer mom’s” when they aren’t the kind of people that even know NISA exists, nevermind this game.

      • shadowind

        I’d rather believe NISA than a bunch of very amateur conspiracy theorists like yourself, that’s for sure…

    • Doomgaze

      This is factually the only business in which you don’t have the right to do whatever you want with your own money without somebody calling you “entitled”.

    • X_Bacon

      I get your point, but you don’t have to be so rude you know…

      • shadowind

        I know that, but I’m just frustrated at those who make a huge-ass mountain out of a molehill, especially those who whined without knowing what was going to be changed in the first place.

  • Matthew Wong

    Its funny how many people are actively stating NISA didn’t approach
    the rating boards, when one of there representatives, Houk, was quoted as
    saying:

    “But I would like to note that we did get in touch with all of the rating
    boards about this title, providing them with sample scenes, images, and
    dialogue from the game. Based on their feedback, we decided these
    changes would be necessary in order to make a release possible in all
    regions.”

  • Wtv

    Never wanna this game anyway. I don’t want to punish cute girls, I want they happy. Srsly

    • Aesma

      Eh, there is a reason why the terms ‘sadist’ and ‘masochist’ exist, you know. Not arguing, just informing.

    • bassgs435

      then for your own good, avoid anything and everything related to Madoka

      • Wtv

        Hm…I think the happy part is off…

        I just don’t want to punish them, then.

    • Thatguy

      But they are happy, when you punish them :/

  • ZetaSiren

    What was so bad about the Japanese release that they have to make “changes”?

    • Dewey Defeats Truman

      Nothing in particular other games released stateside haven’t had before.

    • Mika Moreno

      I’m guessing sexual voice acting ._.

      • Dewey Defeats Truman

        I really doubt personally that some voice acting with a sexual tone would be enough to justify a rating higher than M or the PEGI equivalent (18 I believe?)

        I mean, while not sexual, there voice logs in games such as Metal Gear Solid V: Ground Zeroes much more disturbing and more likely to cause reason for a higher rating than a few moans.

        • Yaro

          Its interesting how there was absolutely no controversy around ground zeroes, and there is something to be outraged about IMO. (although I dont have a problem with it since its fiction and Kojima, so it was an effective scene)

    • Laith Rem

      A lot of BDSM stuff that doesn’t really fly in the States. The art style making the girls look too loli which… yeah. Mind you it’s not bad, it’s a different sensibility between the West and the East.

      • Wtv

        Now I wonder if japanese gamers were angry when Bioshock Infinite was censored there too.

        • British_Otaku

          There is probably no better way to make people import than not having the definitive version of a game, for some Japanese gamers, the English voices for primarily English, censoring major details or part of the charm of the experience arbitrarily counts as well.

          Books, movies, TV shows and manga would be open to whatever Bioshock Infinite probably lost in Japan.

      • Albel

        And yet as prude as they still are, the states are also home to the biggest sex industry in the world.

        Oh and let’s not forget all that torture porn on tv/movies too…

        • Laith Rem

          Yeah but the porn industry works on way different rules than the videogame industry.

          Let’s not say that society is hypocritical because I ain’t stopping once I start.

          • Albel

            The thing is, all of this isn’t based on rules or even laws, no this
            is all self censoring from almost exclusively american companies.
            I don’t think I need any company in the world telling me as an adult what is acceptable or not. And neither do millions of other people, including americans, I assume.

      • ZetaSiren

        Thank you. Honestly I think that itself isn’t half bad compared to other things in games. I remember conquer live and reloaded on og Xbox had that massive “not for kids” sign on the front. I’m thinking companies should just start plastering that on instead of censorship. That way they know what they’re getting into.

  • Mika Moreno

    The minor changes they described don’t bother me that much, but censorship to this degree is annoying.

  • Aesma

    Personally for me,
    ‘Fog’: …okay, like Mugen Soul then? That’s fine, with the voices, I can understand what is happening anyway.
    Then,

    Removal of Japanese voice during the scene:

    :(

    …..NISA, Mute button exist for a reason, you know…

  • DizzyGear

    Good grief the dramatic reactions of some people… If its *really* that important to you you folks than import the JP version.

    This PSP version of Criminal Girl has been requested many times and the Vita is slowly becoming the goto platform for niche games so its understandable they took the gamble of bringing it over with some censorship.

    But personally speaking if was NISA i would have skipped Criminal Girls and used budget for a PC port of htoL#NiQ instead to avoid this whole shitstorm in a teacup. It would prolly sell better as well…

    • Dewey Defeats Truman

      “If its *really* that important to you you folks than import the JP version.”

      If the best solution people have for playing a niche japanese game is to import it then the localizers have made a huge mistake.

      “the Vita is slowly becoming the goto platform for niche games so its
      understandable they took the gamble of bringing it over with some
      censorship.”

      The people that love niche games hate censorship, it really isn’t understandable.

      • DizzyGear

        Speak for yourself. Some people dont mind the censorship if it means the differance between being able to play the game in English or not at all.
        Also dont forget that NISA took a pretty hard punch to the gut when GUST got bought by Koei Tecmo and Idea Factory decided to publish their games in the west themselves. So yes NISA taking the gamble with this game is in fact very understandable.

    • http://linkapics.tumblr.com/ Linka

      The Vita becoming this kinda platform is actually sorta a godsend. I have a strange fantasy of them coming out with Vita 2-in-1/3-in-1 games like KH Remix has been of their PSP ports, maybe with upscaled visuals/the Disgaea 4/DD2 sprites. I think it’d be cool if we could get like, an LPR/Disgaea 1/Disgaea 2 set, and then a Phantom Brave/Makai Kingdom/SOUL NOMAD??? MAYBE? PLEASE? set. Maybe that’d actually have a chance of coming out over here.

      Of course, this is all fantasy and me wanting to wish this dream world was true.

      • Yaro

        Please dont remind me there will never be soul nomad on vita. It hurts.

        • http://linkapics.tumblr.com/ Linka

          You don’t think it hurts me when I think about it. sob.

      • DizzyGear

        Well the Vita certainly has momentum now so who knows. But i do wish the Vita would get more Japanese indies somewhere down the line.
        Steam has Recettear, Croixleur, 100% Orange juice, Fairy bloom Fresia, etc. Their all great games that i would love to play on the go.

        • http://linkapics.tumblr.com/ Linka

          Agreed. I sure wouldn’t mind Recettear especially on more systems– that was a fun game!

          I am glad the Vita does have more momentum now though, especially in Japan. It certainly turned around.

  • Albel

    Just remember people, it’s people calling for censorship in cases like
    this and companies self-censoring in return why the whole argument about
    games being an art form falls apart.

    So next time somebody runs amok killing a few people and video games are blamed as influencing said person, let’s ask those same people calling for / approving of censorship now, about their stance on the matter. Video games must be the reason right? Because apparently some drawn chibis/lolis are what’s magically turning people into pedophiles too. Not like some y’know mental illness.

    • Dewey Defeats Truman

      I just wanted to say I’m glad I saw this post because it presents an opinion on the issue I didn’t even really consider. Art should be above censorship, we as a human race are better than that. If you want to claim games are art you need to be committed to that no matter what you think of a game’s content.

      • Laith Rem

        Okay no stop. No, no nonononono.

        Look okay you don’t like censorship and you are defending your posture and that’s cool and I respect it. But if you are telling me Criminal Girls is art I will laugh at you just as if you told me a Michael Bay movie is art.

        • Wtv

          Michael Bay movie is art. Bad art, but art. Please don’t be elitist with a word.

          • Laith Rem

            I kinda studied about it a lot, so I need to be elitist with the word. It was in the handbook =V

            /tisajoke

        • Dewey Defeats Truman

          If Citizen Kane is art then Transformers is art. If The Last of Us is art then Criminal Girls is art.

          Art isn’t what you want it to be, it just is. But that’s not the argument at hand here, the argument at hand is about censorship and cut content.

          • Laith Rem

            Art is censored too then. Lots of nude paintings of scenes of the bible were censored in medieval times because purity, sanctity and all that. Music gets censored in this day and age by the by. Architecture has to follow rules and regulations and sacrifice some of it aesthetic to function, etc.

          • Yaro

            I wasn’t aware we are still in medieval times.

            EDIT: Also I would like to say that censoring music is something that should absolutely not exist as well.

          • Albel

            This. Was just about to post the same.
            Then on the other hand, one has to consider the young age of the states…

          • Dewey Defeats Truman

            Your first example is irrelevant because it is based in the Middle Ages, which I’m sure you realize was almost 1000 years ago. Your second example is irrelevant because while it does appear censored on the radio/TV/etc. the uncensored version is still freely available for anybody searching for it unlike with games where the best you can get is importing a version you can’t understand at all. And your last example is irrelevant because architecture is built around these rules and regulations while games, specifically this one, is already done but has rules and regulations forced onto it that it never had to worry about during the design and creation. Rules and regulations that, frankly, I’m not entirely sure actually exist. I know I’ve said this before somewhere in the comments here but there are many other games that get by with an M rating at most that have far more worrisome content for ratings boards.

            And regardless, just because it is censored does not mean it should be.

          • Yaro

            Damn, well said. I didn’t even realize the part with music. It’s like the trailers for the game could be censored, that’s totally fine, so they can air anywhere to any audience, but the game itself should be obtainable uncut.

            Again, great response.

          • Shippoyasha

            I really wanted to articulate that point, but you have done it beautifully as well.

            I think the problem is that the modern perspective on ‘art’ is that of ‘praise’, ‘rising above the rest’, ‘respected by everyone’. People don’t seem to grasp that art is beautiful precisely because it can be something that can be niche or risque and not for everyone.

            Funny thing is, as much as people make fun of porn/hentai stuff as crass and low brow, many ‘high brow’ museums have featured erotic art as something to be appreciated in an uptight museum space as well. So there’s always a room for appreciation for these things. Even if many would argue they may not have the broader appeal of more mainstream appealing works.

        • Yaro

          Look at modern art paintings and photographs. It’s easy to say something is bad or good, but it’s still subjective opinion on an art piece.

      • Yaro

        You dont really need to call it art. Just call it fiction. Why would fiction ever need to be censored or banned? Those who find it offensive can just freely ignore it.

  • Nyanko

    So, you are telling me that a game about bug-eyed anime girls in lewd poses will get AO, but games full of tits and gore won’t…

    • Sheyenne

      This the good ol USA

    • Aesma

      I’ve always assumed that there are double standards in the rating. If the game came from overseas, then the rating will be strict. But that’s just the conspiracy theorist in me speaking, I hope.

      • Wtv

        I think they just have weird valors. Every GTA game should be AO, for example. Not because there’s violence or sex, but because of the morally questionable content. If they think some game will influence kids, it should be these realistic open world games where you can be a bastard without consequence.

        But there’s not explicit sex scene, so it’s okay.

        It’s like sex is worse than murder, i dunno.

        • Yaro

          Wait, you would rather see two people killing each other rather than two people having sex?

          Not that it has to do anything with the article, but your comment caught my eye.

          • Wtv

            It was sarcasm. Like…that’s how these rating see those content. Not what I think.

          • Yaro

            Oh ok, I thought that’s really strange. Consider replacing “I think” with “It’s like” to avoid confusion.

        • Aesma

          I’ve heard that Europe and Japan are more severe towards violence while USA is more severe to sexuality…

  • Land of Green Pasture

    wow there’s just so much comments, never a Vita game receiving this much… well I guess because of the ‘censorship issue’, for people who are not even willing to buy the game, they sure like to criticize about this case…

    • Bob Slim

      When it comes to censorship talk everyone has something to say. Its just the way it is

      • Yaro

        And the way it should be. I think it’s great to see that people care about the topic.

        • Juan Manuel M. Suárez

          People don’t even care about this game. They are just crusading like online morons. Oh yes, you don’t get to see borderline H material, the World is falling apart~!

          • Yaro

            You dont need to care about the game to care about censorship. But you are just baiting me…

      • Land of Green Pasture

        true, however it’s just I find it quite funny, is not going to buy the game, and yet talking trash about it? guess that’s what internet made of..

        • Bob Slim

          Pretty much thats how trolls are made

    • SaiyanJedi_Trunks

      People love to complain. It’s true, I don’t like censorship – however NISA is not the only company that has to do so for games to get released in the West.

      I personally am grateful I get the chance to play them.

      • butts

        “I don’t like censorship – however NISA is not the only company that has to do so for games to get released in the West.”

        Except they are actually really are the only company pushing this censorship agenda when it comes to localizing games like this.

        So yeah.

        • DanijoEX ♬ the Cosmic Owl

          Idea Factory has their share of it too. Not just NISA. Remember the Monster Monpiece Censor?

          Look it up, bucky.

          • Aesma

            Different situation, in Monster Monpiece, you can justify the censorship. And it still keep the pics and art of ‘less’ risque version of the cards. They even keep the rubbing mini game.

            In here, they more or less ensured that the CGs are gone (Like in Mugen Soul) and the translation will not match the actual events (Again, like in Mugen Soul). To add, they removed the Japanese voice from said scene, which is the only way for those who (will) play the NISA version to understand what is ‘actually’ happening in the original version.

          • DanijoEX ♬ the Cosmic Owl

            Either way, censorship is still involved. It’s up to people to see it as good thing or bad thing. Many see censorship in a different light/view/and so on.

        • SaiyanJedi_Trunks

          That is actually false. Idea Factory has done it with their games and even Square Enix had it with Bravely Default.

          so unfortunately…yeah.

    • Robert Dexter

      Maybe the people complaining wanted to buy the game?

  • davidvinc

    Is this a dungeon crawler or a traditional map game?

    • http://linkapics.tumblr.com/ Linka

      It’s a dungeon crawler RPG.

      • davidvinc

        Thanks for your reply, too bad I would have loved a traditional world map game.

  • kyrt

    Yeah I am done buying NISA games. I am sick of their blatant censorship of so many of their titles and enough is enough. I’m done with them as a company (as someone who has bought every game (majority of which are collector’s editions) I think will actually hurt them.

    I am sad that NISA has fallen this low and as far as their games go I’m done. It of course it is not completely their fault if what they say is actually true and this is the result of the ESRB rating these games as such but if this is the case, there are many other games out there with far worse content than this. The ESRB rating system is horribly flawed and is incapable of change and specifically seems to have it out for japanese games likely because of the belief that so many people actually think that anime and other similar things to japan is nothing but porn. so screw you ESRB.

    Enjoy the game those of you who wish. I myself am sad to say but I’m done with any game or company that does this type of bullshit to a game. If I can’t play it how it was intended with nothing cut or altered out then obviously I’m not meant to play it.

    • Dkmariolink

      Um… You do realize that games such as Demon Gaze and Dangan Ronpa were not censored at all, right?

      Not every game they localize gets censored.

      I freaking love NIS, and always will. Just their customer support alone is amazing, dood!

      • Asianwarwallabe

        Are you just going to conveniently ignore the complimentary bugs (up to and including melting your PS3) that every single NISA game has, or the 1990′s style translations?

        You shouldn’t hold a company up as a sterling example when their “good” products are the exception, not the norm.

      • Dewey Defeats Truman

        While Danganronpa has not been censored, personally I find it distasteful that they cut what was originally a two game bundle in japan into separate, fully priced releases for the states. That kind of decision that just reeks of “we want more money”, the censorship that pops up a lot lately, and the bugs/glitches that also appear are why I don’t buy most NISA games. It’s not so simple as “I hate censorship so I hate NISA.”

        • James Galizio

          This. Thisthisthis.

          When I talked to Houk last night, he tried to pin my plan to boycott on the censorship, when it was really that and so much more. It’s disgusting.

        • Aesma

          Aren’t they originally released as separate games though? Danganronpa’s case is understandable actually. Compared to how they removed Idol DLC in Hyperdimension Neptunia V without any reason and denying it.

          • Dewey Defeats Truman

            On the PSP yes, but the Vita version was two games in a compilation called Danganronpa 1・2 Reload.

          • Aesma

            I see… never knew that. I’ve assumed that they released the two games on both PSP and Vita, then make the ‘Reload’ as a special version…

        • Dkmariolink

          Oh yeah.. I forgot they did that…

          Well, maybe they needed more money to localize? So they sold them separately?

          Well, dosent really bother me, as I already played the first one on PSP…

          • Dewey Defeats Truman

            I don’t want to say that you need to hate the same things I do or anything, but I do hope that you see why I think it’s a problem.

            I also forgot to mention the usually low-quality translations but there are some that are well handled to be sure. I personally haven’t played the Danganronpa games, but I assume they’re the best they’ve done lately if only because they have to be aware that these games are going to be their best sellers for quite a while and putting out a high-quality product would be a good idea. But then, I assumed the same thing of Criminal Girls (as far as “putting out a high-quality product” is concerned), and look where we are.

          • Guest

            I think they released them separately due to due to how much text to translate and localize there is between the two games(which, aside from silent parts and parts programmed to use only voice clips, also needed to be voiced). Another reason, too, but I forgot what it was(probably about seeing how well the first would sell, which was VERY well I think, and if it’d be worth it to bring both).

    • Sheyenne

      No one telling you buy their games lol

    • SaiyanJedi_Trunks

      I despise censorship, however, I love NISA because they localize games that would never see the light of day in the West. If it takes a little bit of censorship to get them here, then I’ll take it.

  • Robert Dexter

    If all it took to release the game was to remove some audio and add a bit of steam to some images, then there shouldn’t have been any problems releasing it uncensored. It sure as hell wouldn’t have lowered any ratings.

    • kurbstar2

      Because this isn’t going to be just ‘light steam’. It’s going to be full-on obstruction, or just enough transparency to maybe see some skin tone.

    • Aesma

      Recall, Mugen Soul (If you played). In the place where there was a CG in Japanese version, all that is left was… a white screen. …a pure white screen… with translations that completely do not match with the Japanese voice’s translation.

      From that moment on, I’ve decided that NISA is not a suitable company to localize a ‘fanservice’ game.

  • Shippoyasha

    What a hot mess this is for NISA. I mean, they usually do a good job localizing some titles, but when they have their share of bad translations, glitches not being patched out and now they get hyper selective about censoring out risque content. Even some of their flagships like Disgaea actually has some censorship at the edges as well, even including some visuals not being there at all.

    What worse is the justification they have for censoring at any cost, while there are plenty of companies that believes in and practices non censored games. What’s really damning is that ESRB and PEGI seems befuddled by all this and it just is very, very damning for NISA. One has to wonder if Japanese developers/publishers may start wanting to distance themselves from all this drama and maybe even create their own localization branches like Koei Tecmo is starting to.

    As for those wanting to escape this drama full stop, there’s always imports. Thank god we’re talking about a Vita game, where it’s beyond easy to import something from a western import retailer.

  • AkiraScare

    Loyal to Nis so ill buy it no matter the censorship XD

    • Dewey Defeats Truman

      It’s not healthy to be loyal to a company no matter what they do.

      I mean, I’ll admit straight up that I’m loyal to XSEED after amazing games like Half Minute Hero and Retro Game Challenge, and buy many of their games day one at least partially solely from a desire to support them. But if, for example, Senran Kagura: Bon Appetit were to come stateside in state where content was cut or censored I would definitely not purchase it. If such cut content or censorship became the norm for their releases I’d buy far fewer games from them. I know I never bought Yakuza 3 (by SEGA) because of the removed minigames involving hostesses, even if I don’t like them in the other games.

      I understand if you love a company and want them to do well, but it isn’t a good idea to support their bad decisions.

      • AkiraScare

        If u really want to get something uncensored lookup online some fantranslated and uncensored Hentai games… and ull get wat u want XP

        • Dewey Defeats Truman

          Senran Kagura: Bon Apetit is a rhythm game, not a porn game. I am interested in it in particular because I like rhythm games. I wouldn’t buy it if it was censored because I think that is in bad taste and insulting to the customer.

          • AkiraScare

            And i wouldnt get senra cause i hate oppai…. lol

            But i know what u mean i was kinda sad when IF censored Monster Monpiece :’(

          • X_Bacon

            Why were you sad? You could just look it up online too, along with some “fantranslated and uncensored Hentai games”.

            …now you see the problem with this kind of argument?

          • otakumike

            lol It’s true that underneath all the boobs & butts that there is a rhythm game but don’t go pretending that said Rhythm game is DEEP underneath those boobs & butts. It’s an Ecchi game, first and foremost.

          • Dewey Defeats Truman

            It doesn’t help to just write something off because of the aesthetic it uses. I don’t write off Project Diva because I don’t like vocaloids personally nor do I write off the DJ Hero series because I don’t personally see the appeal of becoming or pretending I’m a DJ.

          • ThatGuy3190_7

            So allow me to place myself in your shoes: I like Project Diva because of the rhythm music and gameplay, but I don’t particularly care for Vocaloids. Understandable. I like the DJ Hero series for everything but I don’t want to be a DJ or pretend I am one. Understandable. I don’t like the localization of Senran Kagura rhythm game because even though it has everything I enjoy in a rhythm game, the snip a tiny bit of excessive eye candy that does not bother me or my tastes but may bother others who find it a bit tasteless but also want to enjoy the game, therefore I do not like it. That doesn’t make any sense.

          • Dewey Defeats Truman

            The gameplay is always the most important thing, but I have a personal issue with censorship or cut content of any form and would not buy it on that principle. I personally don’t find the girls in Senran Kagura sexually appealing, that’s not why I played Burst. I just wanted a good beat-em-up for my 3DS.

          • ThatGuy3190_7

            Now we’re seeing mostly eye to eye. Lol. While I don’t have anything against censorship, I understand that it is a bit of a necessary evil but not to the point to completely change the entire thing, kind of like how they must have bleeps on television but still keep the story, theme, and message in tact.

      • ThatGuy3190_7

        A decision that may be bad for you or a select group of people may not be bad for all. Some people may want to play it but not be exposed to so much. If it were uncensored, then it is pretty much saying “This game isn’t for you, go play somewhere else”, even if they are of legal age.

        • kurbstar2

          “this trailers looks sweet and now I’m hyped for this game, but I wish some things were censored”

          Says no one ever

          • ThatGuy3190_7

            More like says your inference. There are some people who do not watch trailers but read about it before purchasing, as there are some people who makes a purchase blindly. Assuming people and buyers have information that is readily available in this day and age is a bit naive. Besides, I never said or implied that someone who has access to online information or media such as a trailer would say, wish, or express a desire to buy a game but wish it was censored.

        • Dewey Defeats Truman

          This particular type of censorship doesn’t even remove the content though. It just coats it in enough steam that nothing can be gleamed from the scene and removes all the spoken audio. It doesn’t seem to appeal to either those who want the original content or don’t want it outright.

          • Asianwarwallabe

            It does remove content, though. The audio they are removing it not just “mere” moans, so don’t let NISA downplay that for you.

            They also say short phrases and sentences, which change over the course of the game. This reveals insight into characters, and serves as character development.

            NISA is removing character development from this game. Not just moans.

          • ThatGuy3190_7

            Someone may play the game and enjoy it but find the audio (if it weren’t removed) to be unsettling. To some who may be unaware of the censorship may still enjoy the game. Ignorance may be bliss but to expose the truth to someone who is unaware of it may do more harm than good, affecting their psyche, future actions, and possibly their way of life.

          • Dewey Defeats Truman

            “Someone may play the game and enjoy it but find the audio (if it weren’t removed) to be unsettling.”

            They can always mute their Vita. As it is this removal only hurts the game. As others have mentioned there are some important character development lines in this mode that are just gone now.

          • kurbstar2

            So…. Regulation through trigger warnings

            Yeah, I’m walking away now

  • kurbstar2

    They convienently left out that they are making changes to the dialog as well, more than likely to work better with the censorship they are doing. Such as the renaming of punishment time to motivation time

    So now we are getting a 4kids translation included with the unnecessary censoring. I’m sold….which incinerator do I throw none of my money into?

    • Slickyslacker

      Play-Asia of course, so you can get that sweet, Famitsu DX Pack.

    • Aesma

      The changes to dialog is already an unspoken rule, as seen in Mugen Soul, Mugen Soul Z, some scenes in Disgaea, Hyperdimension Neptunia, Guided Fate Paradox and well… basically almost all games they released.

    • Guest

      Its not a 4kids translation. 8U

      • Carlos Daniel Flores Loreto

        Let’s wait for Kisaragi’s backstory then. Shall we?

        • kurbstar2

          Completely forgot about that. They are going to create plot holes and inconsistencies bigger than goatse

          And the gameplay is pretty basic, to be honest, so….NISA just destroyed their last selling point

        • X_Bacon

          Could you tell me what’s that about her backstory, without spoiling too much?

          • Carlos Daniel Flores Loreto

            IIRC, she was GREED. She kept wanting more and more expensive accesories, which she got from, ehhh, wiki: Enjo-kōsai (援助交際?) (shortened form enkō (援交?)) means “compensated dating” and is a practice which originated in Japan where older men give money and/or luxury gifts to attractive women for their companionship and, possibly, for sexual favors.

          • X_Bacon

            Ohhh… Yeah, I’m familiar with enjo kosai. I’m both curious and unwilling to see how this will be handled on the localization.

            Thanks for the info.

          • Aesma

            I predict they’ll change it into a story where she cosplayed and parodying anime character while the older men are changed into otaku or anime fans.
            Joking.

            But seriously, I wonder how they are going to explain that one…

          • Carlos Daniel Flores Loreto

            Have her steal the accessories from her friends. Damn, I should take my resume to NISA. Genius.

          • Aesma

            Hmm… that sounds quite right. Greed are usually associated with stealing or extorting something after all.

      • kurbstar2

        I thought I made the irony pretty clear, but I guess not

    • Sheyenne

      Motivation time don’t sound bad of a translation who said a little punishment is a little motivation?

      • kurbstar2

        Punishment is clearly negative interaction, while motivation ranges from neutral to positive interaction

        That subtle change will change the tone of the story dramatically, possibly even making it inappropriately lighthearted if done wrong

        No one trusts NISA with accurate translations, let alone making script changes that will effect the entire story

      • Aesma

        There is a problem that can be assumed from this.
        If they changed one of the ‘main’ term used in the game so that it will be ‘lighter’, who knows what else they will change?

      • Robert Cisneros

        the real problem here is the game is in hell, when do demons motivate people…… they don’t they punish

      • Sheyenne

        To Robert Cismeros they Motivate people by brute force and punishment them.

    • Natsu Dragneel

      I hope they make changes to the dialogue or it wouldn’t be actual sentences in English. Did you not no that when translating japanese to english you have to adjust the sentence to make sense and even swap some of the words. Yes even subbed releases do this. You ever watched a subbed anime where it said I love you in the translation? Lol, I’m sure alot of people have, guess what. I’ve been slowly studying japanese and I can confirm to you “I love you” cannot be said in Japanese, but things similar like I adore you are the natural displays of love etc. It’s ironic people complain about adjusted dialogue when people don’t even know, unless you know japanese you’ll never be reading the exact dialogue and it has been adjusted accordantly

      • Aesma

        Makes sense in English? The problem is not that. The problem is that their translation missed its mark.

        The problem is that they changed characterization, terms and possibly, the whole backstory of some characters because they deem it to be too ‘dark’ for the story. Which is supposed to be dark, by the way.

        You are studying Japanese? Guess what? I am too. And I can tell you that a lot of scenes in Hyperdimension Neptunia and Mugen Soul are different from what they translated.

        • Natsu Dragneel

          I never played Hyperdimension yet, nor have I played or been interested in Mugen Souls so I don’t know these details. That’s why my reference came from anime. I’ve only gotten into more Niche Japanese games over the past 2 years, and haven’t tried those 2 because I wanted to try Nep from the beginning and Mugen I had no interest in. I assumed the translation was slight altering, like cutting fuck you down to I hate you or something. what you said, that’s just crazy bad. But like I said with a earlier reply my statements retracted (but won’t be deleted)

      • X_Bacon

        I’m sure that’s not what he meant, and I’m sure you know it too.

        • Aesma

          …actually, I doubt he knows what kurbstar2 meant…

        • Natsu Dragneel

          No actually I don’t know exactly what was meant if what I was saying wasn’t what it was about lol. I don’t usually play games that have been censored so I have no clue what else is the issue.

      • Carlos Daniel Flores Loreto

        Except NISA would translate “I love you” to “KYAAA my blood pump goes *thump* *thump* 4 U >o< ZOINKS!" in a Neptunia game.

        • antithesis

          Now I remember one of the reason why I stop playing Neptunia.

          After watching a lot of anime, and Super Sentai, I can pick up certain phrases. The Japanese dub was totally conflicting with the English text which threw me off.

          Happen in Danganronpa also but since the game is so good, I was able to push past that.

          • ShadowDivz

            Tell me about it.
            The first hint was, a japanese dialogue talking 2 minutes, with me only seeing 1 line of text.

            But yeah, as you said, after you pick up some japanese you notice …”discrepancies”

          • Zak Ledward

            In this case “discrepancies” meaning, the lack of an entire paragraph and/or story

        • Natsu Dragneel

          LMAO, that was actually funny. I’ll be playing Hyperdimension for the first time next month with Re;Birth. If I hear a line like that I’m a die. I’ll admit that’s quite bad lol

      • kurbstar2

        Liberal wording is fine as long as it remains faithful to the original source material.

        The issue here is making changes to the original source material

        • Natsu Dragneel

          Well I can’t argue with that logic lol. You seem well informed, unlike most complainers so my earlier statement piece is retracted (I’ll leave it for the world to laugh it though lol).

  • Muhdoka

    Well it seems that everyone here is pumped up and emotional, as per usual with these censorship issues. In any case, I feel NISA has been rather disingenuous in regards to offering details about the censorship (but I suppose they have no choice as a business if they want to sell this to as many people as possible), so allow me to offer some insight and help any potential buyers to make an informed decision.

    Let’s start with the steam effects. As implied in NISA’s statements, the Japanese version of this game already uses steam effects. NISA will be adding more to images they find “problematic”. Personally I’m not sure what this means. Will they only be adding steam to the CGs of the younger looking characters in the punishment minigame? This could create off-putting inconsistencies between the CGs.

    As for the sound, as NISA has stated, all voices are entirely removed from the punishment minigame, both English and Japanese. This is significant for a few reasons. The voices are a sign of progression throughout the game. The way in which the girls react to punishment changes as you advance in the game. The voices also include short phrases which reveal details about the characters. And finally, the punishment minigame is going to feel incredibly jarring and totally immersion-breaking if the girls don’t react at all.

    Though this article fails to report on it, NISA has also gone on record saying that they will be rewriting parts of the script to avoid taking the subject matter towards areas they wish to avoid. The game includes topics like teenage prostitution. I can imagine that this might be one such subject matter they have in mind. I’m just concerned about whether or not they can manage to keep the writing consistent and sound.

    Now many of you might say to all this that “it’s just a minigame, the core gameplay won’t be affected”. I hate to say it, but the “core gameplay” is incredibly mediocre. If you want a dungeon crawler, you can do far better than Criminal Girls. Ultimately the true appeal of niche titles like these lie in the fanservice and quirky minigames. And in this case NISA did everything in their power to take those elements out. The only reason they can’t remove the punishment minigame entirely is because unlike Mugen Souls, the minigame is not inconsequential this time around. It’s the main selling point of this game (to people who actually knew about this game prior to NISA’s announcement), yet as we can see in NISA’s trailer, they are trying to sell this game on its mediocre dungeon crawling gameplay. Not a lick of footage from the punishment minigame is shown. Rest assured the punishment minigame is censored enough that it might as well have been removed. I personally can’t see any justification in buying the localized version of Criminal Girls, outside of brand loyalty to NISA (which in itself, considering recent releases, is a questionable stance). Plenty of other companies bring niche titles like these completely uncensored, and again, if it’s the core RPG gameplay you’re after, there are plenty of non-niche games that excel more at this than any of these niche games could ever hope to.

    As for personal theories as to why NISA have decided to enact these censorship decisions, I’m honestly at a loss. I find it quite hard to believe that they would affect the game’s ability to obtain a saleable rating in any significant way. Steam or no steam, voices or no voices, unless NISA is hiding something from us, the punishment minigame will still have you abusing girls masochistically. Though a humorous theory I’ve seen floating around is that the removed voices were too steamy for English dub actors. In any case, many people have asked NISA representative Houk on the NISA forums for specifics regarding their “unofficial” conversations with the ratings board employees, yet Houk continuously dances around the subject and delivers standard PR lines, and the official statement reported in this article more of the same. Combine all this with the fact that NISA was previously very clear about not wanting to localize the game despite the large demand, the fact that they went against their own aversion to localization only after the Mugen Souls fiasco suggested that localization of Criminal Girls was a very bad idea, and the rumors about troubles with the parent company, and you end up with one incredibly fishy localization announcement.

    • Aesma

      Eh, by this point, I’ve given up on Criminal Girls (NISA version). I’ll import the Japanese version soon enough…

    • Carlos Daniel Flores Loreto

      I remember the original PSP game was one of the most wanted localizations. I never thought we would get it, and as you said, I also find odd how they now announce it, even though they were so against-it before.
      Well, not surprising after losing GUST and Nep.

    • kurbstar2

      Couldn’t say it any better (or wordy) myself. You could definitely play off the mugen soul censoring as insignificant to the bigger picture, but you can’t definitely do that here

      Almost seemed like an ill-informed attempt at the Sakura kagura audience, with zero clue why people liked it so much

    • http://twitter.com/matty_125 matty

      Thanks for summarizing a bit about what’s going on. There were a few things bothering me, and this fills in some holes.
      I guess my only assumption about all of this is that it was the decision on Japan’s side maybe? The parent company, I mean.

      • ShadowDivz

        …That wasn’t a summary.

  • Ziggy Wish

    It funny when a case of censoring is always brought up people get emotional like it a religion, or something. But yet the same people who or boycotting the game is the same people who want more games to be localized. Stop being hypocrites when it comes to matters like this, part of localizing is censoring believe it or not, it been going on for awhile. Don’t want it censored, learn Japanese. And you want to know why us anime, and Japanese game die hards get a bad wrap like this.

    • Aesma

      …I think the word you are looking for is ‘bad rep’. But well, in my opinion, some censor are acceptable, some are not.

      • Ziggy Wish

        Yeah but I don’t think most fans realize why these changes occur. We need to understand that people find our hobbies strange enough, now throw in questionable themes and situations, we will have the feds breathing down our backs. They already think a few ecchi titles represents child porn, which is stupid. America just don’t get it like we do.

        I would like everyone to look at this video:http://www.cnn.com/2014/06/18/world/asia/japan-manga-anime-pornography/

        This is why games like criminal girls are censored, want to fight the problem start with the source

        • Albel

          Yes, so let’s give cnn even more clicks on their stupid propaganda, so that hopefully somebody over there decides it’s worth it to spout even more lies and bullshit about it!

          Wait…what?

      • ShadowDivz

        No he means wrap. Whenever i order fast food and the topic of me liking anime comes up, my wraps are always badly done.

        • Aesma

          That sounds quite horrifying… What manner of curse could possibly do such a thing?!

          Hmm… doesn’t sound cool enough. How about this?

          That is indeed, a horrifying news. What manner of foul sorcery could do such a terrible thing?!

    • X_Bacon

      They get emotional because they care about these games too. If you also care about them enough to learn a new language, you should be able to understand them.

      • Shippoyasha

        Great point. The reason people are angry is not because they don’t care. it’s precisely because they care.

  • Kumiko Akimoto

    Really the audio too? I was hoping they just stopped at adding granny panties on the characters. That’s a bummer.

  • SaiyanJedi_Trunks

    386 comments!

    All one has to do is shout censorship or anime boobs on Siliconera and the comments poor in. :/

    • Aesma

      Because mankind are very concerned about boobs. …oh, and freedom. But mostly boobs.

      • SaiyanJedi_Trunks

        All things serve a purpose :)

    • Shippoyasha

      With NISA, it’s been a long time coming. They can do good works from time to time, but they have been very iffy with censorship in their games for a very long time now. Not to mention the added beef of quality control on top.

      • SaiyanJedi_Trunks

        The censorship I do understand…I personally dislike it but for some of the games they do with what the West would refer to as “younger” characters, I understand.

        As for quality control. There are glitches that I have noticed lately which have to be taken care of especially. Witch and the Hundred Knight has a horrible reset glitch. I still love it, but these things need to be taken care of for proper quality.

        • Matthew Wong

          They are improving with the censorship. After Mugen Souls having its mini-game gutted, it seems they are taking in the criticism and working on it.

          • kurbstar2

            anything other than none is no improvement

          • Aesma

            Hmm… we’ll have to see with this. If they removed the punishment CG completely like in Mugen Souls, that means this is not an improvement. As they did the same thing as Mugen Souls in addition to removing the voice. That’s two or three steps backwards.

            If they keep the CG (but censored it) and removing the voice, that is one step forward and two step backward for them.

          • kurbstar2

            I would argue that it’s worse, because instead of butchering one area that’s off to the side, they’re making little cuts to the entire game, which adds up to a bleeding mess

          • Aesma

            Well… in term of CG, it is an improvement compared to that… pure white monstrosity in Mugen Souls at least… No voices this time though, so still a step backwards for them.

          • Matthew Wong

            They said they are censoring the punishment CG, not removing it, and only the punishment voice’s are removed, the game itself will still have voices. I think you were thinking they removed voice audio from the entire game, but I’m not too sure.

          • kurbstar2

            and those voices they are cutting are actually essential to character development

          • Aesma

            Last time they did that, Mugen Souls’ pure white screen happened… And the voices I am talking about is the Punishment scene’s voice. Because that is actually an important characterization scene…

          • Matthew Wong

            I know about Mugen Souls. The thing with the voices I do have a question. I’m not that good with Japanese so I can’t tell from what I’ve seen, but what kind of Characterization is there? From what I seen it looks like a fast moving mini-game.

          • Aesma

            The characterization in Criminal Girls’s Punishment Time? Well… putting aside their… ‘erotic’ talks. It actually shows some of the characters’ trait (Can’t really find specific example though). …which, now that I think about it, won’t be able to be done in English version anyway.

            In the Japanese version, it is simple enough to match the ‘voices’, ‘tones’ and the archetypes of the characters. The way the girls react to the punishment shows what kind of person they are, but since west doesn’t really have the same ‘archetype’ lists like Japan (Tsundere for an example) and NISA is planning to change the translation… Those who are interested only in English version aren’t losing out much.

          • Matthew Wong

            Well then honestly, I don’t think its a step backward. From what you said, I was under the impression important character details were revealed in the mini-game. I feel that we can pick up on the type of character the girls are without the audio in the mini-game. To me its a step forward. Isn’t it unfair to say that its going backwards for not removing the mini-game, along with voices like in Mugen Souls? I don’t remember the mini-game’s voices being in Mugen Souls.

          • ShadowDivz

            Well, before the dialogue, the voices at the end of the punishment games(and before) pretty much reflect the girls mental states.

            Example the first girl i chose to [spoiler] Ran. Goes something like this

            “Screw off”/”Go die”—-> “I don’t want you touching me” —>”That wasn’t…too bad”—-> “Y-you can be a bit gentler” —> I forget, something about it being over to soon. (or maybe that’s Kisaragi*).

            As long as the written dialogue holds up, the world doesn’t end. Contrary to what so many people believe.

          • Aesma

            How are they going to do that though? Subtitle only doesn’t have the same ‘impact’…

          • ShadowDivz

            Oh yeah that’s true. It’s not just the fact she tells me to go die, it’s the way she says it.
            Hmm… I guess some parts of the game are lost if muted.

            I can tell you played the game*high five*. be honest, Ran is a total bitch at the beginning isn’t she? But i found she changed the most, which is why i chose her to become [spoiler redacted]. Even though i liked Kisaragi* more

          • Aesma

            I only managed to play part of it (borrowed from friend’s PSP), that’s why I am trying to import the Vita version.

            From what I managed to play though, I know how she is at the beginning (Can’t comment about the ‘changed’ part though, since I only managed to play a bit).

            Katsuragi? Did you mean Kisaragi? Maybe you got her confused with Senran Kagura’s Katsuragi? My favorite (for now) is Kisaragi though. It might change once I import and actually finish the game.

          • ShadowDivz

            Yeah, sorry my bad. xD
            So many japanese names memorized. I blame years of watching anime.(no regrets though)

            edited and fixed. =)

          • Aesma

            Hahaha, no problem. I agree though, Japanese names can be complicated.
            First you have two names with different kanji but similar reading.
            Then you have two names with different kanji but the exact same reading.
            And then, you have two names with exact same kanji but different reading.

        • Shippoyasha

          I think the risque element of ‘loli’ characters comes with the territory though. Even ESRB/Pegi has indicated that alone would not be an AO rating coming.

          I just wish some other localizer tried their hand or the Japanese publishers did something themselves.

          The quality control is unforgivable though. It’s been a constant stream of games with horrible coding.

  • FitzpatrickPhillips

    Stuff like this is why I learned JP so I can watch this chaos happen from afar. This stuff is ridiculous.

    • SaiyanJedi_Trunks

      Smart move and the most logical one. If one wants to get the full benefit of anything, it is best to learn the original language so it can truly be appreciated.

      • Albel

        You know, while I share the sentiment on the language thing, standing by and doing nothing is in no case a smart or logical move, it’s what you’d call a part of the problem.

        • Shippoyasha

          To be fair, talking to NISA is an exercise in beating your head against a brick wall. Some people have been trying to do that for a solid decade. I’ve been a lurker in their forums to know the kind of shenanigans their PR has been like through the years.

        • Aesma

          In this case, joining in will just add more fuel to the fire. So staying away is a smart move. Maybe rather than ‘staying away’, we can say… ‘observing the situation, away from the battlefield’.

          • Albel

            Oh believe me, in some ways I’d love for a lot of content – especially eroge – to just stay in japan and never get officially localized at all, since I myself don’t necessarily need translations. But then again, without those same translations I also never would’ve gotten into it in the first place.

            Anyways, as it stands now we’ve even had things like the artist of dragon’s crown apologizing for his art direction, all because of some “outrage” of western “news sites”, which indicates this stuff is even starting to affect japanese companies.

            And seeing as they’re already struggling amongst themselves in regards to their own “ban-laws”, bad press from overseas sure as hell won’t make their life easier.

            That’s why no, I won’t be quiet about it and simply watch until it’s too late, no matter how small my voice may be, we all have to start somewhere.

          • Aesma

            Well… I agree about that… but Siliconera isn’t exactly the place to start that kind of attempt. You’d better off doing that in Japanese forum or news website rather than here…

          • Albel

            Nah, I’m not cut out for that stuff, why? Because I don’t nearly care enough about it to dedicate my life to some “noble cause”. Not afraid in standing by that.
            But from time to time – especially if I’m bored -
            I’ll take part in some discussions that interest me on one of the few gaming sites I can still stand to read. Besides, maybe, just maybe someone else will read these discussions and possibly even be motivated
            to try and change something for the better.

            Sometimes it’s also nice to see other people sharing your own opinion, so there’s that too ;)

          • Aesma

            Hmm… that’s a good point. …makes me wonder about those historical ‘heroes’ that seem to dedicate their life for a cause… Maybe they were bored too and one day, decided to ‘why the hell not?’ and changed history.

            But that is going off topic, so I bid thee farewell, lest a mod interfere…

          • Wappuli

            I dont remember Kamitani apologizing for the actual art style of the game at any point.
            But he did apologize for how he responded to a Kotaku-writer who wasn’t all too impressed about the game. Said response:
            https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=429947370434109

          • ShadowDivz

            In his defence, he didn’t know Kotaku was a terrible place.

          • kurbstar2

            I seriously don’t get that tabloid. They full up their article quota with wierd Japan sex stuff, but as soon as it involves a Japanese video game, they go balls to the wall whiteknighting

          • Albel

            You should see polygon :P

          • kurbstar2

            I have enough problems with anger, thank you very much

          • Albel

            Yes, and then there was this:
            “I apologize to those who were made uncomfortable by the art’s appearance, and did not see the same light-hearted fantasy in my designs.”
            http://kotaku.com/the-artist-behind-dragons-crown-explains-his-exaggerat-482450927

            Sure, one could argue this whole thing was a humble japanese style fuck you, but still…

          • Shippoyasha

            I can’t be the only one to think it’s very childish an insult for people to resort to ’14 year old fantasy’ at someone who doesn’t have any shame in drawing fantasy art. Sadly, it seems people have taken a rather harsh stance against fantastical art these days. Politics and art. It’s really like oil and water and something that should not be mixed if it could be helped.

          • Maksim Tsirulnik

            I’m a little hesitant to bring it up, but another example that had a lasting effect is that whole “Rapelay” fiasco.

            A game that’s never even been localized outside of Japan caused such a huge scene that some Japanese sites that sell/develop similar games now have their IPs blocked from being accessible outside of Japan. Just so another such incident doesn’t happen.

            it’s really quite sad that people are willing to go to so much lengths to ruin things for others when it doesn’t effect themselves in the slightest.

          • kurbstar2

            They would of never found out if it didn’t say the word Rape on the cover. Just like with 100% of what is sold on mangagamer

        • SaiyanJedi_Trunks

          Actually, with all honesty, I was only referring to him learning the JP…not actually watching the chaos from afar. I would rather no censorship. However, as someone who prefers the original Japanese language in anime/games, I think the best way to enjoy this entertainment is with the original vocals – so learning the language or gaining a grasping of it would be paramount.

    • Aesma

      I prefer ‘hilarious’. And yes, leaning Japanese is one way to avoid this. My skills can only take me as far to ‘spoken’ lines though. I still can’t read kanji that well… Any tips for that?

      • ShadowDivz

        You pretty much just described me.
        When the lines are spoken it’s okay. I mean, you miss some things here and there but generally you pick up the situation at hand.

        When kanji enters the scene, it’s just “wait… what? Does anybody here speak english?”

        • Aesma

          Agreed… some simple kanji are easy to remember but… well, when you are talking about the obscure ones or the ones with 9 strokes or more…

          • ShadowDivz

            Tell me about it. the increase in strokes = decrease in kanji size

            Sometimes it’s like “wait that looks like…no, hang on i think it’s…”

            The worst part is when it takes you awhile to recognize all the kanji you remember, and then realize that japanese people read that paragraph in like 3 seconds. Hell i don’t even read english that fast.

          • Aesma

            …hahaha… They say that the older you get, the harder it is to learn a language… I am experiencing that quite painfully…

        • FitzpatrickPhillips

          Well it is one thing to get the general situation but I prefer to actually understand everything. Of course, this can be achieved through many different methods. First, you have to actually go through grammar studies so you can actually put things together, then you can go passed just knowing the general gist. Plus, I personally don’t believe you can understand spoken lines.

          That said, the best way (I found) to learn grammar and how to read it is to go through either Genki 1 & 2 and/or read through Taekim’s grammar guide. There are many useful beginner kanji on the list as well as other vocab. After that it is just a matter of constantly reading as much as you can as you build up your vocab and grammar skills. It takes a lot of work and isn’t easy but once you’re free from waiting from localizations or dealing with stupid localization choices then it’ll all be worth it. I played Criminal Girls already years ago. Its a great game – a shame to see it go through this and risk sales numbers.

      • Zak Ledward

        Attach your “spoken” knowledge to the written text. So long as your spoken ability is relatively smooth, you should be able to attach words with their corresponding kanji. Of course, some, if not most kanji will just come down to memorization, since there will be those 15 stroke-guys that will ruin your day.

        • Aesma

          Hmm… I’ve been writing unfamiliar kanji that I’ve seen. Try to read it and recall the meaning. Then try to make a sentence with it. Then the next day, repeat until I can memorize that kanji…

          • Zak Ledward

            Works. Usually if you play through a game, certain Kanji will appear multiple times, so you could always use that promise of multiple instances as a form of practice.

          • Aesma

            Alright, thanks.

    • Dewey Defeats Truman

      If you felt it was necessary to learn a new language just so you didn’t have to deal with these kinds of issues, I think that says something about the localizers.

  • Carlos Daniel Flores Loreto

    So, we are not having the Gallery and Punish Gallery on the MAIN MENU as well, right?

    • Aesma

      Assuming you aren’t being rhetorical, I believe we either have a crippled Punish Gallery or no Punish Gallery at all.

  • ShadowDivz

    Let’s be honest, most of the people talking about it weren’t going to buy the damn game anyway. This is just about you guys getting your “justice warriors” rocks off.

    Not only is the game’s premise is S&M, but there are 3 lolis involved. Coming from someone who has ACTUALLY PLAYED THE GAME(PSP) and seen the CG, i can tell you, it’s a miracle this is coming at all.
    We don’t even know if the added steam will completely block the image or not.

    For the record, i’m all for some loli whipping, but that shit just doesn’t fly in the west, regardless of ” the artist’s original vision”. Rules have to be met, people.

    We already know how the media flips out over nudity, we should just hope this doesn’t turn into the ***eplay fiasco.

    • Aesma

      ….don’t remind me of that fiasco please… Honestly, that case is the only reason I am tolerating censorship…

      But yes, actually, this debate is completely useless. But we are bored people in the internet (Or at least, I am) so I am voicing my opinion here. Even though I know it will mean nothing. A debate is always fun as long as it is civil.

      • ShadowDivz

        You and i both know, it starts out civil.
        ….sometimes.

        • Aesma

          Even though my faith in humanity runs thin… I still believe that there are civilized people in this world, who can share opinion without resorting to insults or fabrication, as rare as they might be…

          • ShadowDivz

            Im having better luck finding four leaf clovers.

          • Aesma

            …hahaha…

      • Shippoyasha

        I remain a bit hopeful that this debate is useful in showing NISA’s uglier side to the public and just how much NISA has made its core fandom a boogeyman as a result of this. It’s not like I will stop buying their games full stop.Maybe NISA will get better. I’m not hopeful about it happening at all, but who knows?

        • Aesma

          Actually, does NISA or other companies have people watching or reading Siliconera? If they do, then it might help…

          • ShadowDivz

            Well we’re all human(?)
            So maybe somebody might come across this site eventually.

          • Aesma

            …hmm… hope so. Honestly, I think that listening to people debating about their decision have more impact than reading a mail sent to their contact… This way, they can hear multiple perspectives.

          • ShadowDivz

            Agreed.

          • MrSirFeatherFang

            I doubt they have people whose job it to specifically watch comments sections pertaining to their games, but yes. Folks from companies like XSEED or NISA have been occasionally seen here.

            I would feel like speaking to them directly, such as Twitter, email or their forum, would be the smarter & faster way to get yourself heard.

          • Aesma

            Ah, not that. I mean, do they have someone who read the news here or not. Not the comments, but the article.

            Perhaps, by reading the article, they are curious enough to read the comments, but I am mainly asking if they have someone who are ‘watching’ the ‘news’ or ‘reviews’ for their games.

          • ShadowDivz

            Folks from companies like XSEED or NISA have been occasionally seen here.

            Damn, where are the pokeballs when you need them?

            (seriously you make them sound like legendaries) xD

          • Shippoyasha

            NISA has been found out to be referring to 4chan’s /v/, so anything is possible. Either way, the biggest critics to NISA has been NISA fans themselves. The ones that gets permabanned as ‘haters’.

          • Aesma

            …well, the line between fan and hater is thin. A fan can easily become a hater… Dunno about the other way around though.

    • kurbstar2

      Rapelay was some UNICEF employee browsing amazon one day and pulling a Hellen Lovejoy. Of course CNN wouldn’t pass up the story….they hate Japan in general, it seems

      Unless if it’s glaring right on the box, they’re not going to do anything….because they don’t play it. Agarest 2 has been fine all these years

      • Shippoyasha

        Porn games are…. porn though. I love it when people conflate the broader industry with hyper niche, hyper risque porn.

        • kurbstar2

          The fact that NISA is so scared of an AO rating tells all about what they think of their game….an actual porn game…because that’s what it needs to be in order to get an AO for extreme sexual content

          • Shippoyasha

            NISA seems to be especially cautious of ANYTHING sexual in their game localizations at times. Even Disgaea was victim to that mindset several times. They clearly are going by an agenda going beyond what ESRB/PEGI has established. That’s why people are so peeved off about them.

          • shadowind

            Tell me you’re joking, right? Criminal Girls a porn game?

        • ShadowDivz

          And yet it came to light.
          generally speaking the normies aren’t even aware there are porn games, but somehow that managed to gain attention. Who’s to say it won’t happen to Criminal Girls?

          Hell, unlike that game, Criminal Girls is actually getting localized.

          • Shippoyasha

            I don’t disagree with you about the media stirring up trouble at all. That’s an unfortunate fact of otaku gaming in general, even in Japan. I just wish this hobby can hunker down and stand up for their content instead of worry about what demagogues and haters will have to say. Let them say their piece then go away. Look at all those controversies of years ago. None of their outrage has stuck around.

          • ShadowDivz

            True, no matter how ruthless, it does die down.
            But while it’s going, it does indeed go.

            I just wish it never started in the first place…
            But regulations have to be met.

      • ShadowDivz

        Wait, really? That’s how it was discovered?
        Makes me wonder what he was searching for…

        And if it does become the new
        I’m calling it now.
        Everyone will remember me calling it, and they’ll say “Man, ShadowDivz totally called this”

        Although if it wasn’t for that media coverage i would have never discovered one of the best most disturbing games i’ve ever played. So, you know, necessary evil.

        • kurbstar2

          yes, it started from a Amazon marketplace listing with someone from the states selling their imported copy. UNICEF themselves might of not found it themselves, but they’re the ones who were most vocal about it

        • Shippoyasha

          Rapelay wasn’t even that big a deal as far as porn games go. Funny thing that the rapist gets brutally murdered at the end, no questions asked.

          CNN ran the story like we are supposed to be having that game stand side to side with the likes of Mario. CNN has been god awful for 6, 7 years now. All their opinion pieces are some kind of a ‘social nightmare’ commentary. The worst kind of ‘journalism’. More like governmental agenda. They have been found out to be in the bed with the government so many times, people don’t even call them out on it anymore.

          • Albel

            From what I remember they did ban it in japan a few years later though…

            Either way, I just had to giggle when I saw how Illusion released リアルプレイ -Real Play- earlier this year ;D

          • kurbstar2

            it resulted in a voluntary halt in production of Rapelay, and a promise that Illusion games will never be sold outside of Japan

          • Aesma

            Ah, saw that as well. My friend showed me the ad of Real Play in a magazine he bought (…well, ‘that’ kind of magazine), we both just shook our heads and prayed that it didn’t end the same way as the ‘original’.

          • ShadowDivz

            There is a sequel to my favorite disturbing game?

            Wait, isn’t it mostly a scene maker?
            Or am i thinking of Premium?

          • Aesma

            …well, since I doubt Siliconera will allow a link, you can search for it at getchu, 795061 is the id.

            I don’t know if it is only a scene maker or not, but from what the ads showed, it is similar to the ****lay.

          • Shippoyasha

            True. Illusion realized that foreigners getting a hand on porn games is only going to result in misunderstandings.

            Sad how CNN of all things were standing in as the ‘voice’ of America.

            It gives me a headache thinking misinforming media coverage is supposed to be be the ambassadors of culture. Just how ass backwards is that?

          • Albel

            Now just imagine what it feels like to watch this kind of nonsense unfold, from the middle of nowhere, in europe.

            THAT makes your head spin ;)

          • Shippoyasha

            I agree. As bad as American moral outrage can be, some of that has been made into written law in Europe. Pretty terrifying case of social engineering at times.

          • ShadowDivz

            No it was’t. Euphoria is much worse…
            But this isn’t the place to discuss our pronz.

            Rapelay was just the unfortunate chicken not fast enough to cross the road. I’m just hoping CR:I doesn’t suffer the same fate.

            They even interviewed a girl who downloaded the game and ask her if she was offended by it, because you know, she’s a woman. And she was just really chill about it, because you know. G.A.M.E

          • nonscpo

            I’ve never heard of Euphoria, what’s so bad about it?

          • ShadowDivz

            Depends on what your limit is.

            google search visual novel database, 2 of the screenshots answers your question.

            Il even save you half the trouble, intercourse happens while one of the girls is on the verge of drowning. >_>

            As for the other picture…see to believe. Need worse? Check out the trailer for the 3rd episode. first 5seconds is a decapitation. >_>
            (i literally just yelled out and closed the page. i thought i could handle anything…)

          • Albel

            Well, let’s wait and see what they’ll do with fraternite later this month, shall we? xD

          • ShadowDivz

            Fraternite the hell is?
            *vndb
            …..the more innocent the cover seems, the more i worry.
            And the story sounds like it will reach all kinds of fucked up.

            Although to be honest, i respect clock up for doing messed up stories.

          • nonscpo

            Dammmmmm!

          • ShadowDivz

            Yeah. Imagine SEEING the CGs.

            Don’t even get me started on Tinkerbell(or is it tinklebell?)…

          • http://twitter.com/#!/kaishou Kaishou

            Boy you don’t want to know. The shit that goes on in it is probably one of the most convoluted and disgusting eroge out there.

          • ShadowDivz

            The shit that goes on in it.

            Unintentional pun?

        • Armane

          You realise Illusion Soft almost went bankrupt because of that sensationalist garbage? You realise the knock on effect it had on eroge localisation for years?

          I hope you see how hypocritical you’re being calling out other people as not being interested in a game until it was censored.

          • ShadowDivz

            Dude i was kidding, chill. O_O
            Im hoping that DOESN’T happen to CG:I

          • Armane

            D’oh. Well… that’s what I would have said, if you were being serious.

            I see NIS continuing to struggle in the future after those staff problems, and therefore NISA. So I could see NISA going bankrupt in the next 5 years. They have effectively been stripped of their biggest sellers and seem to be chasing cheap properties in the hopes of a big hit. But I don’t really see anyone reporting on CG:I as the worst thing ever (except the wet sock game bloggers). Heck, maybe CNN would even commend it for it’s corporal punishment.

          • ShadowDivz

            How is Nisa stripped of their biggest seller? I missed out on alot of gaming news because of school.

            Something about KT buying gust?

          • Armane

            KT bought Gust, Idea Factory created Idea Factory International, who will presumably translate Neptunia going forward, and most of the Disgaea staff left due to issues with non-payment.

            NISA lied to CH/IF/NIS about people wanting their games on PC, which is partly why IF decided to create IFI. And if NISA can lie to their parent company, I don’t think they are above lying to their fans about censorship of their titles.

      • Zak Ledward

        If I remember correctly, they changed the box art for Agarest 2 slightly so that the title hid Eva’s cleavage because apparently that’s a bad thing.

        minor, minor, minor things

    • Shippoyasha

      Games like Demon’s Gaze barely got any mention from mass media though. A lot of mass media don’t even have it in their radar unless someone stirs up sensationalist nonsense.

      It’s a hyper niche game and I wonder since when did ALL game have to be in the same public space as all mainstream titles? It’s just a really strange dynamic happening these days. The ‘miracle’ aside, I’d rather wish they’d have stayed in Japan. Also, as risque as many Japanese games can be, they are hardly pornographic.

      • Jadfish

        They censor the games in case someone from outside the niche audience picks up the game. Lil’ Timmy buys Demon Gaze, SOMEHOW figures out how to beat enough of it, but get stuck at a sexy loli snake boss thing. Go asks his dad to help him, and his dad, being a preacher in the local catholic church, immediatly spots satans work and rounds up the pitchfork wielders.

        This scenario might only have a 0,001% chance of happening, but if it does it’s simply not worth the trouble to a lot of companies. That’s probably why Nintendo censored Bravely Default’s sexy costumes a little too.

        • Shippoyasha

          I get the logic as twisted as it may be, but that just seems to indicate a nanny state that gaming is becoming. Which I don’t agree with at all.

          The Bravely Default thing annoyed me to no end, because getting an unsullied version means I need to jump through hoops compared to simply importing something on a Playstation console.

          The BD thing just confuses the hell out of me, because the outfits are as tame as they come. And I am still shocked at people thinking that chibi-designs = child designs. That just still stuns me how people can make that kind of a correlation.

          • Jadfish

            A lot of people that play video games have no idea what chibi is. To them it looks like children. I agree that I don’t like this is going though…..

    • Andrew A

      If your argument is that this is a necessary evil for NISA, then why bother localizing it in the first place? Doesn’t sound like they should be wasting their time with this when they could be busy adding game breaking glitches to far better games.

      • Aesma

        If I remember correctly, didn’t a lot of people requested the translation? While NISA refused, perhaps something had happened (Maybe IF’s decision to localize Neptunia by themselves) that caused them to look for other titles to localize? Must ask NISA themselves for the answer…’

        But yes, I am still waiting for Mugen Souls Z’s patch…

        • kurbstar2

          money makes you do stupid things. This is clearly out of NISA’s comfort zone.

          I seriously wouldn’t hold nothing against them if they just scrapped it all tomorrow, and begin work on a different (and more than likely better) game instead

          • Bob Slim

            This is getting so out of hand I wouldnt be surprised if that happen,

    • Robert Dexter

      Uh, I would have bought it, I would have bought Mugen Souls and Mugen Souls Z, too, but I’m not going to buy it when it has been censored. Don’t generalize everyone as “justice warriors” who don’t actually care about the game!

      • ShadowDivz

        I changed it to “most” better?

  • AndyNPC

    I find it hard to believe that the ESRB was actually considering an AO rating for Criminal Girls. CERO is far stricter than ESRB or PEGI, and CERO won’t even give a rating to games with highly explicit content. I know that every board looks at the games individually of other boards and other games, so different ratings are possible in other regions, but realistically a CERO rated game wouldn’t be getting an AO from the ESRB.

    I’m sure NISA is thinking “better safe than sorry” more than they’re thinking about preserving the original game.

    • http://twitter.com/matty_125 matty

      IIRC, they have to pay each time they submit their game for rating approval. I think it’s smart to have it done in one go, but then I guess you get this level of self-censorship at some point?

      • AndyNPC

        According to their posts on their own forums, they had come to the decision to censor the game based on “unofficial discussions” with ESRB employees.

    • kurbstar2

      ESRB is very good with being consistent with their rating scheme.

      If you look at Agarest 2, it almost has everything NISA is worried about. Loli character in lewd clothing/situation, player interactivity, erotic voice acting, hell even a popup that says Ecstasy Time when you’re done.

      And that was a T rating. If NISA had anything to be worried about, it would be the theme of the minigame, which even I wouldn’t consider torture, per se. They’re not screaming for help or in pain. Is playful torture a thing?

      • ShadowDivz

        If you look at Agarest 2, it almost has everything NISA is worried about. Loli character in lewd clothing/situation, player interactivity, erotic voice acting,
        ….
        >Amazon
        >r-e-c-o-r-d -o-f-a-g-a-r-e-st
        >add to cart

        Relax, im just kidding!
        I already have the collector’s edition! =D
        (Seriously, i got it around xmas. it was on sale)

    • Shippoyasha

      I don’t get that mindset of shoving an ultra niche game into the same space as that of the ‘mainstream’. Maybe they’re getting the Disgaea popularity get to their heads at this point. I wish I was saying that sarcastically, but sadly I’m not.

  • Kumiko Akimoto

    I feel less enthusiastic knowing that audio is cut, editing artwork, removing a whole sound byte is another thing.

    • kurbstar2

      don’t forget the edited script they “forgot” to mention in their press release

      • Kornelious

        Edited script? Don’t tell me that they’re changing the dialogue as well!

        • kurbstar2

          yup yup. There was an unofficial announcement in their forum a few days ago that mentioned dialog changes, and more than likely they will rewrite a character’s backstory, too

          • Kornelious

            WHAT! WHY!? Why is that necessary? It’s one thing to edit some questionable scenes, but to change the story and characters…….C’mon NISA! >:(

          • ShadowDivz

            unofficial! as in, it might be changed….? =D
            Im pretty sure it’s Kisargi’s. How familiar are you with Enjo Kousai?

          • Kornelious

            The more Japanese version of a Gold digger?

          • ShadowDivz

            ..More or less. But it doesn’t strictly mean sex for money.
            It’s more COMPANIONSHIP for money. I.e we hang out at my place and i pay you.
            Sex is not necessarily involved.

            But you can bet your ass im not throwing away money just for someone to hang out with me.

          • Kornelious

            So, that has something to do with this Kisargi character? Or are you comparing it to the actual game?

          • ShadowDivz

            It has something to do with Kisaragi.
            Im saying if they change “rumors of kisaragi doing enjou kousai”
            to “i hung out with some bad people” kinda changes things.

            Rumors of her (maybe) prostituting ends her up in some weird hellish training camp. Makes sense.

            Rumors of her (maybe) hanging out with some bad kids ends her up in some weird hellish training camp. = dafuq?

          • kurbstar2

            are you waking up, Neo?

          • ShadowDivz

            I believe he is, quickly give him the pills!

          • Kornelious

            Y’know….I think i am waking up…..Though i don’t remember which pill I’m supposed to take X(

          • kurbstar2

            I’m glad I could free your mind

          • Kayriss Wins

            character backstory changes? my god this is Card Captors Sakura level of changes!

  • Kornelious

    …..You know what, I’ll take it! This is probably the least they’ve censored a game and is probably gonna be the best were gonna get (Still don’t know why it seems like NISA is the only one who follows the rules of this so called “Rating Board”)

    So there is a little more smoke, as long as we can still SEE (Meaning AT LEAST somewhat visible) the girls then i’m fine. So there are no voices in the punishment parts (Which also proves that the game will retain it’s Japanese dub, to little surprise) It might sound even more awkward with the silence at least I don’t need to turn the sound off AS WELL as hide my screen while in public…..So hey,, silver lining :P

    I was worried when they kept going on about that “Core Game” crap excuse they always use….A little note, ALL OF THE GAME IS THE CORE GAME!…..But I’m actually satisfied with the results…So…..I’ll let you off THIS TIME NISA!…..But i’m watching you!…..(Can you imagine if NISA localized Senran Kagura X( )

    • AndyNPC

      You see, that’s where the term “slippery slope” comes into play. You’re only okay with that because normally you’d expect it to be much worse. Every new censored localization sets a precedent for how far you can take censorship, and they instill this idea in the public that this sort of thing is required. Every change made today will make it harder to preserve games in the future.

      It has gotten so bad that games like Senran Kagura are setting precedents by NOT censoring. People are shocked and sometimes even scared of this because it’s going against what they thought were established rules.

      • Kornelious

        I guess that makes sense, But it’s not like we have the power to change it…..If we did this would’ve been dealt with this a long time ago.

        As long as we continue to endorse the games that we stand against then we are no better than those that censor it…..Unfortunately I am one who will just accept what I’m given :(

        • AndyNPC

          We do have the power to change it, maybe not us specifically and censorship Criminal Girls is more than likely already set in stone, but the course of censorship in game localizations can be changed. Like I said above, Senran Kagura set a precedent by not censoring. I imagine there wouldn’t have been as much of a stink over CG getting censored if it wasn’t happening simultaneously with Senran Kagura.
          That’s because we’re seeing real examples of why censorship isn’t necessary, and how it can actually be harmful.

          Every successful game that gets censored is contributing to the construction of a barrier that blocks potentially questionable content, but every game that doesn’t censor similar content is contributing to tearing that barrier down. Every time you say “NO” to censorship, you’re bringing us one step further to tearing down that wall.

          • Kornelious

            Then I guess companies like XSeed and Aksys are leading this march huh?

          • AndyNPC

            I would say it’s the people who work at them, not so much the companies. Keep in mind that Xseed had originally planned to change the character’s ages in Senran Kagura, but an employee threatened to quit if any content in the game was altered. They settled for simply removing any mention of ages from the game, which was only accepted on the aggrement that the employee be allowed to speak out against censorship publicly without receiving any punishment at his job for it.
            That man is Tom and you can often see him posting on forums where topics like this one spring up.

          • Kornelious

            HE sounds like an awesome guy, Risking his job to keep a game (Even just the ages) form bing censored…..Perhaps their is more hope than originally thought :)

          • AndyNPC

            Censorship is a pretty hot topic. It’s an issue not only for video games but all of human media and really any form of speech. Censorship has a terrifying potential to take our basic human rights of expression away should it be left unchecked. It isn’t only someone’s job and some 2D titties at stake, but the entire concept of free speech.
            I can assure that we’re not standing alone.

          • Kornelious

            Good point, and good to know. Perhaps one day we won’t have to worry about censoring…..Some day -_-

          • Bryce Ward

            I know Tom. I thought he was a pretty rational guy. If he was going to deprive the english speaking world of the game because he didn’t like the changes then perhaps he should have been fired. I am really delighted that NISA unlike Xseed has the guts to stand up for common decency.

          • Robert Cisneros

            you do realize we are discussing a game about girls who have died and are in hell correct? (and because of this have no literal age since they are dead and we do not know how long they have been in hell for that matter so who knows how old they are) also that any common decency for people who have been sent to hell is kinda odd since hell is well suppose to be a bad place without deceny at all where you are to be tortured 24/7 for the crimes you commited so the punishment mechanic is actually quite appropriate for hell, as for Tom he spoke out for what he believes in and more power in him for it, and it shows how much he is needed that they didnt just fire him.

          • AndyNPC

            “Common decency” has nothing to do with it. We’re talking about a video game here, something that is considered private entertainment. If common decency applied to the personal hobbies and activities of the people then you wouldn’t be allowed to be naked in your own shower. All censoring a video game does is cut content. You should be delighted that Xseed has employees who are willing to take risks in order to deliver their customers with the product they asked for, meanwhile NISA is knowingly delivering lesser products.

            Going through your Disqus comments it seems that you don’t understand what censorship means either. You claimed thay Yggdra Union was censored somehow by having content added to it, and that all localized games are censored because the Japanese language was translated. Censorship is not just any situation in which something is changed. Censorship is when information or ideas are deliberately withheld or alterd because it is considered obscene, politically incorrect, or inconvenient for whoever is presenting that media. Translating language is not censorship, all the same ideas are there being interpreted as accurately as the translators can manage. Nobody is being a hypocrite by accepting an English translation.

            But the bottom line is: we don’t want any content cut out of our games. When we ask for a localization, that means we want the same game but in English. When you cut out content, like when NISA removed more than half of the cutscene CGs from Mugen Souls, you aren’t giving us the same game. The fans of these games might be part of a niche audience and it may be rare to ever see the games we want coming to the west, but that doesn’t mean we’re going to settle for a shitty product just because it’s the only way to play it in English.

          • Bryce Ward

            “When we ask for a localization, that means we want the same game but in English.” Meaning you want the game altered except in they way YOU want. Right? It’s okay as long as it’s YOUR way. Changing the game to english is still altering it.

            “The fans of these games might be part of a niche audience and it may be rare to ever see the games we want coming to the west, but that doesn’t mean we’re going to settle for a shitty product just because it’s the only way to play it in English.”

            Sounds like you would rather burn down an entire forest rather than see lumberjacks cut down two trees.

          • AndyNPC

            “Changing the game to english is still altering it.”
            Did you even read what I posted? We don’t want anything cut out of the game, translating the language is not cutting content and adding content is not cutting content. Nobody is up in arms about altering content period, we’re up in arms over receiving inferior products. Quit with this word semantics game.

            “Sounds like you would rather burn down an entire forest rather than see lumberjacks cut down two trees.”
            I’d rather those lumberjacks head on over to the NISA forest and clear out all the rotting trees that have been hosting game breaking bugs, cut content, and arbitrary character name changes.

    • kurbstar2

      NISA are the only ones following the rules? The ESRB was created by trade organizations back in the 90′s so that the government wouldn’t have to step in and turn their industry inside-out with politician-appointed censors.

      I highly doubt they’ll risk a multi-billion dollar industry just to play favors with a few Japanese localization companies

      • Kornelious

        I didn’t mean it THAT literally, It just seems other companies localize similair games with little to no censoring….Some worse that this, Like Senran Kagura or Corpse Party!….

        • AndyNPC

          That’s what I was referring to with my reply about the “slippery slope”.
          The content isn’t breaking any rules, but people will start thinking they are when they see other games censoring similar content. It’s the censorship that makes it seem like it’s going too far, not the content itself.

        • kurbstar2

          NISA does make out the ratings boards to look like the bad guys here. In fact, they’re quite chill. Well, the non-government ones, that is

          • Kornelious

            Wow, They do seem pretty chill……So I guess NISA is just taking this to a whole new level…..

          • Thatguy

            Part, where she/he described Agarest was… i don’t know how to describe. Hillarious, i guess?

          • Tienron

            am i the only who thought the censorship for argarest was rightly just?

          • Bob Slim

            I see if they just remove the word child from the game, They wouldnt had to remove her so they did it for nothing and. They said its no way to prove that they are a child inlest they say it in the game, So as long as they dont say it its not a problem, This really make me think with the whole thing that happen with mugen souls them removing the minigame, If the esrb is the same as this then it was for nothing, Mabye they wanted a T rating I dont know, Im still gonna get criminal girls though I think Australia play a part in this too I dont know there laws or anything, Nisa and the 1 version fits all regions is the problem. What people should be asking is can they make different versions they wont though it will cost them money

  • Ziggy Wish

    At this rate I’m not surprise if companies will stop localizing super niche titles, that focus on fan service.Games like in the case of criminal girls may need to stay on PC, so it won’t be in the view of the general public and won’t go under scrutiny. but who I’m kidding people will still complain that it not on it’s original system.

  • http://www.lrdalucard.deviantart.com lrdalucard

    Hum… what should I say?

  • Luis Edgar Flores Gutierrez

    Ultimately, our goal is to make games
    available to our fans in the West.: They mean for the fans in the U.S.

    • kurbstar2

      They’re hiding behind the objections by the more prudish German and Australian ratings boards, in which the warnings were more than likely much harsher.

      A special version for such territories is not unheard of, but NISA seriously doesn’t want to hear any of it. So we all get shafted, instead

      • Luis Edgar Flores Gutierrez

        Then, they should skip Europe and Australia instead, the American market is more important for Japanese companies after all, right?

        • 永次

          Nope, read Bandai-Namco reports about US and Europe.

  • darke

    Honestly at this point I don’t see the point of localising this, since if they localise it with the changes they’ve said, the bad word of mouth from their ‘fans’ will destroy sales. And it appears to be destroying all good will they’ve built up over the years.

    And I’m not sure what exact fanbase they’re trying to ‘widen’ too? I would have thought the fanbase for doing ecchi things with 2d girls, which is part of the core gameplay of this game, would be pretty well defined. It’s kind of one of those things “you like” or “you don’t”, it doesn’t really have a middle ground given the reviews of other games on the net where there’s even a hint of ecchi.

    Ah well, I’ll wait until release to see how badly their changes have altered the gameplay; if it’s more then just “a little steam here and there” then I’ll go and grab the Japanese version instead.

    Impressive number of posts in the thread though; don’t think I’ve seen a 500+ one before. :)

    • ShadowDivz

      Nothing sparks a discussion like censorship.
      =)

      • Maksim Tsirulnik

        Indeed.

        Especially when people who never even cared about the game in the first place start hopping on board.

        • Shippoyasha

          I don’t think one needs to ‘care’ about a game to care about censorship. Especially when gaming has had such a rough history of it. It’s always an ebb and flow of games being excessively censored, then things calming down for a bit and then companies deciding to justify censorship again. Sadly, I see no end to this, as so many ratings boards have such a tight grip on game content in many parts of the world (including Japan).

          • darke

            Right. I’ve bitched about blood-and-gore related censorship before; and I don’t even like gory games.

            At it’s core, censorship is a slippery slope problem; most people don’t care about censorship until it affects something they do care about.

        • shadowind

          Personally, I’m one of those who hates censorship, but at the same time understands that there are times when things have to be censored for cultural reasons.

          • Maksim Tsirulnik

            I’m the same way. Personally, I think that there should be no censorship at all…but this isn’t a perfect world. There will always be issues over one thing or another.

            My acceptability of the censorship, or any changes really, relies on multiple factors. What is being censored/changed, why is it being censored/changed, how essential is it to the core game (as in, if it was completely removed, how different would the story, the characters, the gameplay, the setting, the aesthetic, etc. would be), how was it handled, how essential was it to have censored, etc?

            For example, “Yakuza 3″ had 2 minigames along with part of a side-mission completely removed in its localization. But you know what, “Yakuza 3″ is one hell of an enjoyable game. There was already so much to do in that game that the removal of such a small part hardly effected the game as a whole.

            I’d rather there be 99.9% of a game released so that thousands of people can have the option to enjoy the game for what it has instead of having a grand total of 0% released so that no one can enjoy it.

    • Maksim Tsirulnik

      Actually, they aren’t trying to “widen” the game to everyone.

      Right out of the article provided:
      “Making the changes necessary to release some of out more niche titles in the West is not, and never has been, an attempt at making the game more appealing to a larger audience.”

      People are just taking what was said in a different discussion regarding a completely different matter and taking it out of context.

      • Cerzel

        I would refer you to this:
        http://www.siliconera.com/2014/07/11/nis-america-explains-changes-criminal-girls-invite/#comment-1481370263

        And you might again argue that it’s “a different discussion regarding a completely different matter and taking it out of context”, but you’d be wrong. It’s a valid statement and is relevant to the subject matter.

        NISA also didn’t mention in this article’s press statement that they’re going to be editing parts of the game’s script with subject matter they want to avoid, but that doesn’t make their statement that they intend to do so invalid, either.

        • Maksim Tsirulnik

          Sure, just stuff words in my mouth and bring up something that is off topic to what I’m referring to. That’s going to get you far.

          Well, first off, there’s this statement by Houk:
          “No other scenes or content will be removed. As a general approach, we are being very conscious of the general tone of the game and making sure that we retain the spirit of the story and characters without taking things too far (this will mostly consist of terminology choices and character interactions here and there)”

          You are kind of making stuff up by saying, “…they’re going to be editing parts of the game’s script with subject matter they want to avoid…,” since nothing about the actual changes to “terminology” and “character interactions” was noted, unless I missed or forgot something. Terminology changes and some dialogue tweeks have been something NISA has been doing for years. Making things more easily understandable or working around Japanese sayings and locations or whatnot for the western audience.

          Now then, could what you have said about them changing the above to avoid entering certain trouble areas happen and what I’m assuming is completely wrong, sure. But there is no confirmation one way or another about it. Saying otherwise that it’s exactly what it means is just making stuff up at this point. It’s like how everyone just assumed that the minigame would be completely removed before some actual news was brought to light. If it does actually happen, then you have the validation to complain about it. Until then, it’s just all speculation with little to no grounds to support it.

          Second off, the topic I was talking about being taken out of context was the discussion between one of the translators working on “Fairy Fencer F” and some users regarding some name changes in said game over at the NISA Forums. He said that most terminology/name changes along with dialogue tweeks are made to make things easier for a wider audience to get into the game. That’s it. It was over name/terminology changes, not the removal of content. Yet this somehow translated to people that they are censoring other games, ones that weren’t at all related to the discussion at hand at the time, to appeal to a wider audience. This is what I’m referring to.

          Third off, I’m starting to really get tired of people bring up that Tom fellow. I’m still shakey on the details he’s talking about and the circumstances surrounding it. I’m going to have to do some research revolving all that until I make a final opinion.

          • Cerzel

            “Second off, the topic I was talking about being taken out of context was
            the discussion between one of the translators working on “Fairy Fencer
            F” and some users regarding some name changes in said game over at the
            NISA Forums.”
            Uh, what? FFF didn’t come up in this reply chain at all, you didn’t make any kind of specific reference to it at all, and the linked post from Houk doesn’t mention FFF at all either.
            The post I linked to is specifically quoting Houk saying that they’re trying to reach out to people other than the hardcore fans, and FFF has nothing to do with this discussion.

            And I also didn’t bring up Tom at all, and neither did anyone else in this reply chain.

          • Maksim Tsirulnik

            There appears to be some confusion here.

            I’m not talking about the comment chain, at least not until my third point. Point one is referring to the statement you made, which I quoted as well, and point two is referring to what I was originally talking about in regards to taking things out of context. Point three is addressing the link you provided.

            While on that, the link took me to an exchange between an AndyNPC and a Kornelious who are talking about the XSeed employee Tom so I don’t know what’s up with that then.

    • http://twitter.com/#!/kaishou Kaishou

      You know people complain for the sake of complaining but they still buy the game anyway.

      • kurbstar2

        I won’t be

        you have my word

        • X_Bacon

          And my bow.

          • Meteo

            And my axe!

      • darke

        Sure, a lot of people do. But how much damage to the reputation have they had from this?

        As far as purchasing goes, I’ll likely buy it if it ends up having some stupid token censorship; but if they’re running around gutting dialogue I’ll grab the JP version instead, like I was going to right before they made this announcement.

      • Dylan Anantha

        People said the same about DmC. I’m pretty sure in the end they indeed didn’t buy the game.

  • SaiyanJedi_Trunks

    So many “faceless” commenters on here…most of them in an uproar. For a moment there I thought I was IGN O.O

    People here know where I stand on censoring. However, at this point, either buy the Western release or import it. That’s it.

    Complaining is not going to do anything to NISA.

    • AndyNPC

      You only need to look at the comments here and pretty much everywhere else to see evidence to the contrary. I wouldn’t say it’s “doing anything” to NISA, but it has certainly opened the eyes of many to the issue of censorship. That is very important because one of the main reasons censorship is so prevalent is the perceived notion that it’s a non-issue. Showing that the public hates it may cause developers to reconsider censorship in the future.

      • SaiyanJedi_Trunks

        Evidence to the contrary of faceless commenters mostly in an uproar…ones that have been laying dormant for some reason? Thinking I was on IGN? Also, how complaining has done nothing to NISA?

        Those are pretty much dead on points. You can boast a commentary on censorship as much as you want, however, you are only preaching to the choir in this community who already know this.

        At this point…you only have (2) options – buy the uncensored import version or buy the Western one…or Door #3….wait for it….don’t buy it at all.

        It’s just the facts.

        • M’iau M’iaut

          My trouble with these topics is that by now, we can’t talk much beyond several specific firebrand talking points. It’s hard for someone, board regular or not to post say:

          Uncomfortable with the ‘sex’? Rather than being a prude, what about questioning whether or not ‘naughtiness’ in a video game has to always be moans and coos and panty/bloomer rubs. Why can’t the reason be wanting to see characters with some depth taking a relationship to deeper levels over the course of the story?

          And the power of the ‘possibility’ one could find themselves legally liable for an action is indeed something businesses try to avoid. Not just niche game companies about which folks without business law degrees declare what every judge, in every community will determine for them. Even thinking of the lawyer’s fees attached to ‘assessing’ what would happen ‘if” is enough to pick silence and fog. Practicality for the win. No social statement about censorship either way.

          • Armane

            The reason the industry won’t move on beyond fade to black sex scenes and cheap mini-games, is censorship.

            So in a topic where people are lamenting the censorship of a game, there’s no real point discussing where the industry should go to mature as a medium.

            I’d argue we’ve already seen games that try to explore relationships. Ico slowly leading Yorda through the castle. Journey’s spontaneous companionship and feelings of loss from losing that partner. And although I’ve not yet played it; Brothers: A Tale of Two Sons single-player co-operative dynamic.

          • kanade3

            Such discussions are better suited for a forum that has specific threads for those subjects. When you have a comments section that is set up just like any other news outlet out there you can’t expect people to branch out,and have a more in-depth discussion about the article. This is especially true if the article is about censorship of a product.

          • M’iau M’iaut

            I can certainly expect our community to handle itself on a level different from ‘other sites’. And I do, because usually, they do.

          • kanade3

            Just my 2 cents,but I still wouldn’t expect many positive things coming out of topics like theses even if the community is leaps,and bound better than other places.

            Going back to your initial post,I think people use the statement ” Uncomfortable with the ‘sex’?” as the main reason over considering something like ” wanting to see characters with some depth taking a relationship to deeper levels over the course of the story” because the west just has too many sexuality issues,and said issues lead to things like fan service being persecuted by some very loud groups on a daily basis.Not sure you’re aware of this,but Akiba’s Trip got unfairly thrown in meat grinder by a reporter from a well known mass media news outlet. To add insult to injury she never played the game.

          • Shippoyasha

            I think one step we can go with the likes of that inflammatory Akiba Trip article is to not give power and credibility to them by acknowledging them as any kind of a serious critique at these games.

            While it may be akin to swatting at buzzing bees at this point, a lot of gamers are sick and tired of all this political and moral implications some people force upon the hobby.

    • Robert Cisneros

      wrong i have more options available to me i can do what i did with mugen souls z and buy it used nothing goes to nisa all to gamestop, or i can just watch the entire game on lets play videos you gotta think outside the box its not just buy or not buy.

  • Hinataharem

    This game makes me incredibly uncomfortable. Glad for the people that like this (I guess..)

    • Sheyenne

      Then you don’t need to buy it

    • Shippoyasha

      Hurrah for niche gaming!

  • aizen310

    Oh… we are in that era again?

    • Armane

      Since when were you under the impression that… We left that era?

      • aizen310

        O.O
        S***! I gotten Kyouka Suigetsu’d!

  • shadowind

    I can’t believe there’s nearly 600 comments in the space of the delay; the majority being from people moaning about something that most gamers wouldn’t give a damn about as long as the story is intact, which is for all intents and purposes it is.

    There’s a lot that’s wrong with the world these days, and the fact that people are complaining about something as minor as removed moans and extra fog just makes me think “what the fuck”…

    • Aesma

      Important gameplay mechanic.
      Shows lesser seen traits of the characters.
      Lack impact and possible ‘wrong’ translation if it doesn’t have Japanese voice.
      I don’t mind the extra fog though.

      Thus, my decision not to support NISA for this game.

      • shadowind

        As far as I’m concerned, I don’t see what’s the problem, it’s just added fog and the removal of voices in the mini game? I’m still going to buy it regardless of what others think…

        • Aesma

          Well… honestly, the addition of fog and no voices doesn’t really concern me. The problem is that NISA said they might (almost 100%) change some things in their translation.

          By that, I am worried that they will change:
          1. Backstory
          2. Characterization.

          I am confident that they will change the translation for the Punishment scene. Without Japanese voice, I won’t be able to figure out what the scene ‘originally’ meant. NISA’s translation isn’t exactly faithful to the original…

          • Zoozbuh

            Well dont buy their games and don’t support them then. Are there many other publishers who would risk releasing this kind of game in English?? Take what you’re getting or leave it, that’s what I say.

          • Aesma

            As I said, I am not supporting ‘Criminal Girls’ localization.
            I view each game’s localization as a separate topic.

            I will not buy NISA version of Criminal Girls. However, if they localize another game, then I will check the game and decide if I want to buy it or not. I am not the type to boycott or abandon a company simply because they made one or two decision that does not suit my taste.

          • Zoozbuh

            Well good, that’s pretty rational of you, but unfortunately not everyone is that sensible. (Or maybe they just like to bitch and moan, but buy the games anyway in the end.)

          • Aesma

            Eh, in the first place, I am just joining this debate because I was bored. Even though I dislike some translation liberties they have taken, I’m grateful for them bringing the game out of Japan…

    • darke

      Well it’s clear that they simply don’t think it’s minor like you do then.

      I mean I’d be pretty annoyed if I was German and didn’t get to shoot Nazis in the new Wolfenstein like everyone else did. Maybe people think that removing things from the game that define the game (like the ‘sexy’/ecchi things define this one) might make this game less appealing as well?

      • shadowind

        That’s a whole different thing and there’s a valid reason why changes had to be made for the German release of the new Wolfenstein game…

        • darke

          No. It’s censorship. They don’t like swastikas, so they all got changed to something generic.

          “X don’t like Y, so it got censored”:
          “Germans don’t like Swastikas, so it got censored.”

          “Americans don’t like ecchi and innuendo, so it got censored.”

          Plug your ears, go “la-la-la”, say “but it’s different!”; censorship is censorship.

          I can accept it happens; I can accept there’s reasons for it; and yet I can still dislike it.

          I won’t, however, go “that’s a whole different thing”; because it’s not.

          If the censorship on this game makes the game worse then the original version; I’ll buy the original. It’s as simple as that.

          It’s the same way as if I lived in Germany, I’d be importing the original uncensored version of Wolfenstein, which is what a couple of German friends I know did.

          • shadowind

            You do know it’s possible to be both against censorship and yet understand at the same time why some things have to be censored for cultural or legal reasons…

          • Shippoyasha

            The problem is that the ‘legal’ reasons are a lot of bunk. That’s precisely why people are so upset by this.

            As you say, maybe ‘most’ gamers don’t care about it because it likely isn’t the type of games many people would play either because of the risque content and the genre of game. But that’s why the niche gamers have to stand up for themselves because most gamers simply won’t know what’s missing unless they are told. That’s how a lot of censored content skates by.

            And not sure by what you mean that there being a lot of things wrong in the world. Of course there is. But this is a gaming issue and I don’t think anyone is actually saying that other problems are lesser than a gaming issue. Speaking of gaming alone, purists have always scrounged by and brushed away as ‘extremists’ just for wanting the original source to be treated respectfully upon localization. It’s not a fair attitude to those who just want something to be unsullied upon translation.

            If these issues are minor to you then more power to you. But it doesn’t mean the purist’s arguments are invalid or have no place existing. Not to mention this isn’t just ‘a little fog and voice’. This is pretty much the constant frustration of some gamers putting up with censorship for many years, even decades. What worse is NISA painting people as villains just for having that opinion.

          • shadowind

            Do you have any proof that NISA are lying or are you just joining the rest of those who are making a mountain out of a molehill for nothing?

          • Shippoyasha

            The problem really is that games just as lewd as Criminal Girls made it through even with ratings as low as T for Teen rating. Even some games that NISA itself published wasn’t a far cry from the content in Criminal Girls at all. Again, the problem I have with NISA is their constant vilification of those who don’t agree with their decision or that they’re being transparent about it. The idea that NISA is ever transparent about anything if frankly kind of laughable.

          • darke

            Yes, it’s entirely possible to be both against censorship and yet understand at the same time why some things have to be censored for cultural or legal reasons…

            I’m pulling you up on your “that’s a whole different thing”. And your “people are complaining about something as minor as removed moans and extra fog just makes me think “what the fuck””.

            They’re not phrases normally used by people who are “against censorship, but understand”; they tend to be phrases used by people mocking people who are complaining about censorship.

            One day, someone will censor something that’s important to you, and others will say, “why are you complaining about something as minor as that, I mean, ‘what the fuck?’” and if you don’t understand why I’m complaining about what you said now, at that point in time you’ll probably understand.

            Anyway, I’m one of the weird “games are art” people; who react to people censoring anything ‘dirty’ in games the same way I do when people suggest chopping off the penis of Michelangelo’s David because it’s ‘dirty’. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_(Michelangelo) So I may be coming across as more grumpy then I am. :P

          • DizzyGear

            The average German does not know any better and buys the censored german versions. Only the more hardcore crowd buys uncensored german games from import shops.

          • Shippoyasha

            A lot of German players were talking about the censorship upon hearing about the changes. Germany is a huge demographic and it’s not like they don’t have the internet. You don’t have to be some hardcore nut to understand censorship. Just a few minutes of browsing and you can get the whole situation understood. For PC games, all you need is a patch. For some consoles, you can freely import without worry for region locks.

        • Robert Cisneros

          while i hate to do holocaust references since it is the most extreme and i hate that i believe this fits so i will:

          First they came for the Socialists, and I did not speak out—

          Because I was not a Socialist.

          Then they came for the Trade Unionists, and I did not speak out—

          Because I was not a Trade Unionist.

          Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out—

          Because I was not a Jew.

          Then they came for me—and there was no one left to speak for me.

          i find the censorship issue along these lines and that if it is not spoken against now what will be censored next, also lets be honest the only reason it wasnt taken out entirely was because it can not be its a core mechanic.

  • Jadfish

    Well if you can’t release it legally without changing some stuff I guess you need to change some stuff… This is quite a mess though, since their western fanbase is so dedicated that news like this will spread like wildfire across the internet, and the negative buzzword “censorship” will be thrown around to the dismay of everyone.
    It seems like an actual case of “damned if you do, damned if you don’t”

    • shadowind

      And what’s the odds that a lot of these moaning minnies wouldn’t have bought the game even if it had been translated in English uncensored for some stupid reason or other, such as digital-only or English-only voices, etc.

    • Jadfish

      that being said, has anyone played this on PSP? I don’t think I like the premise that the girls can disobey my commands in battle. I got enough of that in Persona 3 (I still love you Mitsuru but goddamn)

  • shadowind

    This is what I think of those complaining about something so minor as added fog and removed voices…

    • Kumiko Akimoto

      Removed audio is not minor in any way. Ever. Added fog and added clothes to cg is minor but removing a whole sound bite is too much.

    • M’iau M’iaut

      Unfortunately, Anakin already gave his life to save his son and is no longer around to act on this thread’s behalf.

      And I was at work.

      • SaiyanJedi_Trunks

        Thank you for taking time out of your busy schedule. I’m sure you felt the tremor in the force all the way from work, ;)

  • http://youtube.com/kuyamagix iKen

    Awww, but hey. Better to have a release then get nothing right? At least we’ll be able to play the (somewhat incomplete) game :)

  • Armageddon

    I wonder if someone will make an English patch so that we can understand the japanese version instead. Japanese VA’s are a better at the”voices”.

    • Firekitty

      I’m pretty sure the article says they’re removing the Japanese voices from specific scenes only? I mean, NISA localizations are pretty awful, but I don’t think even they’re dumb enough to cut Japanese audio from a game, when so much of their reputation and fanbase was built on keeping it. The Ayesha incident notwithstanding (which I firmly believe that was done to screw over Tecmo-Koei for taking the license back).

  • rika09

    I dont think that this game will sell good after censoring:( Its like senran kagura where people buying it becose its has perverted things not because god gameplay.

    • Shippoyasha

      You’d be surprised. Senran Kagura does actually fill the action niche too. Though it’s also accurate to say it sells on the comedy and visual novel elements as well as the fanservice. Some sites like IGN only cites the action part when talking about the series.

  • Harvey Tejada Loto

    600 comments wow

    • darke

      It’s a contentious topic. It’s tripping over multiple cultural differences since they’re censoring for a ‘global audience’, but there’s no such thing as a ‘global person’ everyone’s culturally different. Some people have lived under a harsh censorship regime so tend to dislike by reflex; some people live in more sexually relaxed countries then the puritanical parts of the US so think the censorship is insane; and some people are happy just to get the game, no matter what level of censorship is required; and then there’s hundreds of other opinions in between.

      It’s definitely more interesting then the usual huge topics about: “Why isn’t Europe getting it? Announce it already!” or “I’m not buying it if it’s digital only! Sign my petition!” and so forth. :)

    • Sentsuizan_93

      It’s like that Tomodachi Life article all over again.

  • Zoozbuh

    They shouldn’t have gone to the trouble of releasing this game for such an immature, perverted, ungrateful fanbase. They came out and clearly explained why they HAVE to edit certain things and it’s not their choice, and just because the word censorship was used, people STILL find reasons to bitch. To be honest the whole ‘punishment’ thing seems creepy to me and this game really isn’t my kind of thing, so I’d be surprised if this sells decently, with or without censorship.

    • Shippoyasha

      ‘clearly explained’. That is the problem. None of it is ACTUALLY clear. There were inquiries made to ESRB and PEGI and it sounds like it wouldn’t even come close to an AO rating. It might even pass for a Teen rating, going by precedence from some other games like it. Stuff NISA itself localized before with even more risque visual content passed by with a T rating.

      And they can call it whatever they want. It’s not the word censorship that’s the issue. It’s the dance and number they’re doing with their own fanbase while shooting down critique at every turn. This is more on NISA going by their own agenda with changing games. There’s absolutely no evidence that says they were actually influenced by outside sources for them to come to their conclusion. It’s just all pretty PR speak, basically.

      Not to mention ‘perverseness’ really is neither here nor there. The game is not supposed to hold things back. It’s simply one of those types of risque games. This game isn’t even that much more risky than many games that already were localized, free of any changes. This is solely on NISA. And they can’t even fess up to that.

      • Zoozbuh

        Err no, you’re going to the other extreme and saying it’s “solely on NISA” and this was ALL their decision, when you have no evidence of that either. Why would they just decide to censor a game for no reason? That’s retarded, there is a reason for most things game publishers do.

        I would say issuing a statement like this is as clear and professional as they can be, without pandering to every person like you who is against censorship. They didn’t have to say anything at all. When it boils down to it, the things actually being edited are VERY minor. When it’s a matter of THIS or not being released at all, moaning about the “principle behind the censhorship” is a little pointless.

        • Asianwarwallabe

          People have evidence that it’s all on NISA, actually. NISA, in their own forums, here, and other places and in their own words, didn’t submit any materials from their game to the boards.

          Instead, they submitted selected bits from the Japanese version, unofficially, to select people from the boards, working unofficially. Anyone with knowledge about how the boards operate (seriously, just read the guidelines or ask them) would know that the boards absolutely can not accurately access and judge the game based on inaccurate subject matter that could be pending changes.

          Therefore, any “discussion” about the rating this game would get is utterly without merit, and ludicrously subjective to interpretation (they are Western speaking boards. It’s almost a given they can not read Japanese and the context (including written text) is highly important to the rating process.)

          NISA decided to censor their game based on this worthless discussion. That is self censorship. This IS all their decision.

          NISA is lying directly to your face with half truths and misinformation.

          Furthermore, your assertation that the censored bits simply are “VERY minor” is simply factually incorrect, for a multitude of reasons.

          • M’iau M’iaut

            NISA has mentioned in the past they pre-talk board members, so has IF and Atlus. Each ESRB review costs money. Money which cuts into profit. If you are given a ‘suggestion’ or whatever one calls it — again, you go with the recommendation.

          • Asianwarwallabe

            That’s great, but when you misrepresent your product to the board (who I must remind you is acting unofficially, so this costs nothing), all the analysis given for your product is meaningless. Which, as said before, is what happened here.

            It’s self censorship merely for the sake of it. There’s no two ways about this.

          • DanijoEX ♬ the Cosmic Owl

            I’m goin with what M’iau M’iaut said. NISA clearly stated they are working with the rating boards. What part do you do not understand?

            By the way…the only one acting unnofficially is you with a lack of common sense.

          • Asianwarwallabe

            http://imgur.com/GTVAgx3 (someone tell me if linking this site is not permissible, seriously)

            This is a direct quote of Houk stating that their interaction with the ratings board is not official, thus proving everything I’ve said.

            There is nothing more to discuss. It’s a fact.

        • Oltheros

          Once again: if they’re going to release a game they KNOW they’re going to censor and cause a subsequent uproar, why localize the game in the first place? Out of dozens of Vita games is this honestly all they could get?

          But even ignoring that, this is a case of NISA self censoring in order to save money on the ESRB reviews.

          • Zoozbuh

            I completely agree with your first paragraph- it brings me back to the original point I made in my first comment.
            As for ‘self-censoring’, I totally understand from their point of view, if they wanted to save some time in the long run, because it WOULD most likely have needed to get cut anyway.

  • Brandonmkii

    I really wanted to try this, but I’m not so sure I could enjoy it knowing there’s these kinds of changes.

  • Anesia Hunter

    NOOOOOOOOOO!! Not the audio during the punishment scenes. That was one of the best parts though. Any chance someone might make something for us to patch it back in or something?

    And more fog? This better not end up looking like a horribly censored anime, like the ones with the blacked out panty-shots and the mysterious beams of light.

    And why the name change? It was already in English to begin with, so is there really a point to changing it now?

  • Rinkawa Erion

    If they can’t give us this game un-altered in any way then they should’ve given us a diff game to localize.

    • Bryce Ward

      Localizing the game itself is altering the game genius.

      • Rinkawa Erion

        When I mean altered I mean removing or changing anything from the game. Or if you can’t understand it, censoring.

        • Bryce Ward

          Your censoring the original Japanese text.

          • kanade3

            I think you’re confused on what text censorship really is.Text censorship is when you remove a word,statement,or sentence because it’s deemed offensive,or inappropriate. Changing Japanese text to English so people so people can understand it isn’t censorship.

          • Bryce Ward

            So it’s okay to remove and alter things as long as it isn’t offensive right?

          • kanade3

            If you’re removing,adding,or altering words in a sentence to get the same message,or point across in another language than that is okay as it falls under localization ,but if you’re altering something like エスティ・エアハルト(Esty Erhart) to Esty Dee than that is not acceptable as you’re straight up butchering a name for the sake of making a crude joke out which goes beyond what localization is suppose to be about.

  • shuyai

    so they are basically censoring all fanservices one of the main selling point of this game?

    actually will US and Euro version be exact same?

    • Asianwarwallabe

      “actually will US and Euro version be exact same?”

      Yes. They are releasing a single version of the game, which is utterly comical, considering their excuse to censor is “based” upon concerns they have over potential rating by various ratings boards.

      This is bullshit in two ways. Firstly, because they are outright lying about the boards ratings. Secondly, because all boards do not rate equally. Even provided that, for instance, the Australian boards rated this AO (or their equivalent), that does not necessarily mean it would be the same for the American release. Does that mean the American release should be censored all the same as the Australian?

      NISA sure seems to think so.

      • Matthew Wong

        Still spouting false accusations? You can say they are lying all you want, but you have no evidence to back it up. Its your word against theirs. They said they sent the footage of the scenes in question to the rating boards, received feedback, and dealt with it accordingly. You said they are lying….over, and over again, without proof. Its clear who can be trusted, and it isn’t you.

        The second issue is a cost issue for NISA. They have said they can’t afford to make multiple versions of the game, as that would increase the cost. They also want to reach out to their fans all over the world, so why would they want to exclude a continent?

        • Asianwarwallabe

          I do have proof. I had it then, and I still have it now.

          http://imgur.com/GTVAgx3

          Their decision to censor is based upon inaccurate (and thus) worthless feedback received in an unofficial manner.

          This is fact, and will not stop being so simply because you disagree.

          • Matthew Wong

            I don’t believe Houk said NISA recieved inaccurate feedback. Stop lying and spreading false info. They received that feedback from the rating boards. I think you need to find actual evidence. Because all your saying is that it was the ratings boards that lied, since they gave the feedback. If you find actual evidence, don’t keep it to yourself. But I doubt it since all you’ve done is lie and call me names.

          • shadowind

            I’m surprised you haven’t been banned with all the bullshit you’ve been posting as well as your clear refusal to accept the truth….

      • M’iau M’iaut

        Please name for me the number of games which got an ONLY IN GERMANY, EXCLUSIVE FOR AUSSIES, and THIS ONE ‘S MURRICA 4 LIFE. version. Even the biggest guys don’t do that. Why are we demanding NISA, IF or anyone else be the ones to change.

        Why is it so hard to understand that the ratings boards are the 800 pound elephant in the room — and they are only there to protect just a little from the 20 ton gorilla called a government. It’s not as if one can’t find all the uncensored torture a loli games games one wants, regardless of where they live.

        If the latter is what one is demanding from this title, drop the theatrics and go play the games being desired.

        • darke

          Terrible, terrible example.

          Speaking as an Australian; yes, that’s normally the way it works for a AAA title. if it doesn’t get past the ratings agencies on the first try, it gets nipped and tucked and pushed through on the third; often we get the shitty German ‘low violence/no Nazi’ copy.

          For NIS and other niche games though, I agree that’s not the way it normally works. The way it normally works is that the countries simply don’t get released in their region (Australia and Germany specifically).

          Now… given that Australia more-then-often simply doesn’t get a game because it’s not profitable; and NIS has a habit of skipping us (Legasistia was particularly galling since the Avatars for it are in the store, but the game? No. Prinny? First game but not the second. Cross Edge? I think we got the game but no DLC… actually looking through this list of the games in their forum, it’s now getting depressing…), I don’t see why they’d not do so again if it was in the least bit inconvenient.

          Seriously, if Australia was an issue, they’d just not release it (I don’t think even their censored version of Criminal Girls would make the cut due to the sex+’torture’ angle), same with Germany since it’ll be an English-language only release anyway.

          I don’t know why they’re doing this, but NIS has proved it will ignore the ‘harder’ countries anyway with non-ecchi titles, so you can’t blame us for their shitty PR. :)

          • Asianwarwallabe

            This is to both you and the mod, actually.

            It’s cute how you are sidestepping the issue, but this isn’t what I said or proposed at all. I didn’t demand NISA release versions for all versions. I didn’t say it was Australian’s fault, as you seem to be implying.

            I said, very simply, with a quick hypothetical example, that their decision to censor the American version of the game isn’t necessarily due to being subject to American ratings boards.

            This was not some sort of nebulous and insidious attack against Australians, nor is it some finger pointing blame-game. I could have said PEGI, and it would have been entirely the same comment.

          • darke

            I agree; I’m almost certain it’s a US-specific thing they’re worried about, myself.

            I only bothered responding to the mod because, as an Australian, what they said in reference to how games are released is the complete opposite as to how I experience it. :)

          • Asianwarwallabe

            Thanks for the insight, then. I’m American, so it’s pretty damn hard to get a scope of how these things pan out from the other side of the world.

            Perspective is some tough shit to manage.

            “I’m almost certain it’s a US-specific thing”

            I wouldn’t be so quick to make that statement, though. Agarest War 2 (a game with content about as “bad” as CG’s) released over here just fine without an AO. As have many, many, many other titles.

            I aint pointing the blame at Australia, (though to be honest you guys have the worst of the ratings boards when it comes to the “big three” in Western lands,) but many things are suspect about these statements from NISA. It’s not unreasonable to try and sleuth out the truth.

          • darke

            When I said ‘US-specific’, perhaps it would be better phrased as a “Walmart-effect” thing? They’re generally loathe to have anything that’s too extreme on their shelves (which is why cases get censored to cover up cleavage and the like), so it’s possible NIS thinks that they’ll need to tone it down to get past their corporate censors.

            Either that or someone inside the company particularly dislikes it.

            It’s just so weird, Mugen Souls’s censorship seemed reasonable as it was just a quick side game. IF and Mon Mon’s cards can be excused as the first attempt of a company not quite knowing what’s possible. But I don’t get why NIS thought that censoring core gameplay was a good idea, let alone that people would just roll over and accept it?

          • Asianwarwallabe

            I’m afraid we’re going to have to start disagreeing. Censorship of any manner is not acceptable.

            Censorship is a practice that has a steep and slippery slope. If you disagree with one form of censorship, then it is your duty to disagree with them all, or you’ll quickly find that what was once “acceptable” censorship for things you don’t care about is now “unthinkable,” for things you do.

            Look no further than this very company to see a clear example. You found it “acceptable” to cut Mugen Souls, because you believed their lies that “it was boring tasteless fanservice anyways” and now they are here cutting actual gameplay.

            Where does it end?

            By the by, IFI is comprised of former NISA-employees. Don’t excuse their censorship as something as nebulous as a “first attempt” at releasing a game. They knew EXACTLY what they were doing.

          • darke

            I’m also on record as saying that I believe “games are art” and that censoring them is like chopping off the penis of Michelangelo’s David. You’re confusing ‘understanding’ with ‘supporting’.

            Though I didn’t actually know that about IFI, so that’s useful to know.

      • shadowind

        Why can’t you whiny self-entitled brats accept NISA had to censor the game because of suggestions from the ESRB and PEGI for it to get a release in North America and Europe or are you too proud to admit that NISA are in the right?

        It’s cretins like you that give us niche gamers a bad rep, you know…

        • Robert Cisneros

          because the following games exist with similar content the rubbing part of monpiece, gta v, agarest wars series, south park the stick of truth where you can anal probe randy marsh among other things, senran kagura, and the leisure suit larry games, and none of them have exceeded a m rating in the us for europe id have to check but i doubt they pass the equivalent rating.

  • Aqua King

    Will this be released in English?

  • http://www.HealyHQ.com/ HealyHQ

    Seriously? They’re straight up lying with their PR-speak. From their own press release (which you can get here, straight from the horse’s mouth: http://nisamerica.com/pressreleases/crim_girl_announcement_20140703.pdf ):

    “In order to bring this title to as many fans as possible[...], NIS America has edited certain aspects of this game.”

    And now they’re saying:

    “Making the changes necessary to release [this] title in the West is not [...] an attempt at making the game more appealing to a larger audience.”

    That’s pure contradiction.

    Another contradiction from this article comes immediately after the previous:

    “We know that censoring a game would lose just as many fans as it may potentially bring in.”

    Yeah, right. They don’t believe this at all. A NISA employee on their own forums stated that people who complain about things like this are a small minority and that if enough people had a problem with their choices, they wouldn’t be raking in profits year after year for the last ten years. How arrogant of them. It seems the more they talk, the further they dig themselves into the ground. It’s only a matter of time before their core fanbase starts to turn on them. Unfortunate. I really used to like NISA. :(

    • Arag

      It seems my comment below was deleted without any reason given, so I might as well repost this here:

      This is the post you mentioned, along with some interesting extra bits:

      http://nisamerica.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=92&t=13487&p=788036#p788036

      “The reality is that no, we’re not trying to appeal to EVERYONE, but yes, we ARE trying to appeal to more people than just the hardest of the hardcore fans.”

      There’s also the funny rhetoric of “we are clearly selling because we are the best in the market” that seems utterly nonsensical. Once they get the contract, the English-speaking consumer base is entirely at their mercy. It has always been like this, games don’t get two or more localizations unless we’re talking about re-releases for new versions like with Muramasa. It’s usually either “play our version or not play at all”, so the idea that they have succeeded because of quality and not because their localized versions of their games are the only option seems to elude them.

  • http://www.gamefaqs.com/features/recognition/21421.html?type=4 Kashell

    I recently learned of all of the…what’s the word…abuse? Yeah, I’ll call it abuse. All of the abuse that NISA has been responsible for with their localizations. Aside from knowing all about Ar tonelico 2, I learned that their handy work has been nasty towards other games. Now I’m seeing the reputation continue. Such a shame…this game looked like it’d be right up my alley.

  • fighting_otaku

    I mean it kinda makes no sense as to what they doing, I mean I love that they are releasing more and more game from japan and such as I been wanting this to happen for years and they finally are but what I dont like is the fact that something is always getting changed or censored for bs reason…

    also they should always keep the original japanese audio in all games and have english to, let us have a choice as I prefer japanese with english text or subs.

    • Zoozbuh

      “Something is always getting changed or censored” Uhuh, sure. I only remember this happening for TWO games out of the hundreds they have released. This one and Mugen Souls, and for very minor things. That is NOT “always”

      • Shippoyasha

        That’s not really true actually. NISA had a long history of changing content. Just because they aren’t as major a change as those two games doesn’t mean they aren’t in a habit of censoring stuff out.

        • darke

          Just tripped over a post about what NISA has been doing with their translations. Didn’t realise just how badly they butcher games at times. I though there was something a bit wrong the the translations of Trinity Universe and Qoga, but figured it was more on the incompetences/lazy/accident side of things then seemingly deliberate sabotage. :(

  • Fintlook

    lol it make it look like the only selling point of this game was the punish system.

    I wonder if it’s worth playing it just for the plot *wink wink*

    • darke

      When I was looking into buying the Japanese version a couple of weeks ago, the general opinion seemed to be that the story was decent, gameplay was pretty meh, but the punishment system was entertaining.

      Given the punishment part is getting a nerf, it’s probably only worth getting if the story appeals to you.

      • Shippoyasha

        Gameplay is pretty decent. Not amazing or award winning, but it’s pretty serviceable.

  • Oltheros

    I think there have been inquiries to PEGI that showed this game would have never got AO even uncensored.

    Tl;Dr NISA’s rating argument is BS. I would ask the readers of Siliconera not support censorship of videogames.

  • Alistair

    Well when I wrote to PEGI they told me they can’t discuss it till the game itself is rated by them.

    Then it be too late to argue for change to the game. I think all this is a smoke screen. If you take monpiece gimmick of rubbing lolis with audio intact but the same gimmick but a different variation that is punishment by touching the gals via vita screen only audio-less.

    IS frankly disgusting.

  • Dashaun Rutledge

    What they should do is something like the gore download that was just recently talked about (the name of the game escapes me right now) but to keep everyone happy you could be able to download the original version via DLC, free dlc of course.

    • Stranger On The Road

      you mean The Evil Within? that was a problem for the Japanese release, as far as I know downloadable content require no rating there. But in the US it does.

      So a DLC doesn’t solve the problem.

    • Firekitty

      That would be the perfect solution for all these bs censorship issues… which means it will never catch on.

    • Maksim Tsirulnik

      That wouldn’t solve the problem though.

      While DLC is allowed to bypass the general ratings, at least I know that’s the case with ESRB, if the DLC actually has content that could potentially change the rating of the game by being included, then the rating of the game has to be changed to accommodate that DLC. Even if you don’t get the DLC, it’s availableness alone is enough to do that.

      It’s akin to optional content in games. Just because it’s optional or skippable doesn’t change the fact that it’s there for people to access.

      And the underlining reason for why these edits to the game are even being made in the first place, whether you think it’s a lie or not, is because of the threat of an AO rating from the rating boards. If that wasn’t the issue, there wouldn’t be any of this censorship in the first place.

      • darke

        Interesting this isn’t the case in Australia, which tends to be cited as one of causes of this sort of censorship. We have a “DLC loophole” where the content is unrated, so you can actually add content back in that’s been removed this way. Saints Row from memory did this a couple of times.

      • Alistair

        & PEGI in its wisdom sometimes I get confuse.

        Because PEGI doesn’t rate DLC it only does if there a questionable content that ups the content more then the core game had eg. Moderate violence to extreme but I do see a lot of map-packs DLC getting rated.

        & even if a DLC get a higher rating then the core game, the core game rating still reminds that.

  • Zak Ledward

    NISA still seems the same even after the Mugen Souls incident <_<

    w/e I guess I'll just pick up the import version

    • Xerain

      They seem to be trying a little harder with this one. In Mugen Souls they cut the whole thing. “All” they’ve done this time is add steam and remove voice clips.

      I have to say the PR spin is pretty amusing. Saying you’ve made a decision based on all regions is pretty much the same thing as making a decision based on one specific region.

      In the end it’s a money issue. They simply can’t afford to make separate versions of the game. While having region specific DLC to bring stuff back within the limits of the specific ratings board is most likely possible, they can’t afford that either. They also can’t afford not release the game in a specific region.

      • darke

        Yeah, but it’s a little different in this situation. You can cut out a little one-off side story easy enough; but when what ‘needs’ to be cut is part of the core gameplay of the title it’s a little more difficult. :P

        • Xerain

          While the bathing Mini game certainly isn’t as integral to Mugen Souls as the punishment system is to Criminal Girls, they removed a lot more content than you post would lead people to believe. It’s certainly not a one-off side story, it was a reoccurring feature to strengthen your characters that unlocked gallery images. In the western release you just use the items to strengthen the characters, rather than rubbing the items on them in the bath. There’s an entire image gallery worth of content that’s not in the game.

          Mugen Souls also had some of the dialog toned down, arguably completely changing one of the characters in the process. But the same could be said about other NISA games, as well.

          • darke

            I use Japanese audio so I must admit I don’t really pay much attention to the subs other then to occasionally clarify what’s said. (Though as you said, it’s a bit difficult at times due to the WTFery or some of the sub decisions…)

            Is there any more detail on the Mugen Souls differences somewhere? When I did a search before I got the original game I didn’t really find anything that stood out.

          • Xerain

            Most of my information comes from the comments section here on Siliconera. When Mugen Souls was going through it’s similar forum controversy phase, some NISA reps were posting here. after cutting through all their silly PR spin attempts, what I took away from it was that IF/CH supported the changes to Mugen Souls for the West. This has lead me to various theorizing as to why, but I won’t get into that here.

            As far as the dialog changes, as I understand it you have this one character who is a hardcore S type, and often verbally abuses other characters, in line with her character type. They changed her dialog so she was more of a “generic sexy type.” Whether or not they intentionally toned it down, or if it’s just par the course for their consistent record of poor localization choices, I can’t say.

            I understand enough Japanese where I can spot differences in subs versus the original lines, and at one point considered playing Mugen Souls to document the changes. However, with so many games to play… just wasn’t worth the time.

          • Zak Ledward

            When you can tell the difference between the dialogue and subs #thankyoujapanese

            Many people have already said it, but NISA keeps trying to take niche games and make them into “relatively” more accepted games. I don’t get why you’d do that when the entirety of the niche group is already willing to buy the uncensored product, and it’s not like anyone who isn’t already into this kind of stuff, will be interested in it, especially something like Criminal Girls. Again, w/e, won’t join the fight since it’s already filled.

  • Maksim Tsirulnik

    Houk, an employee of NISA, started doing a Q&A session, of sorts, over at the NISA Forums to answer some commonly asked questions in an attempt to clarify some things.

    Anyone who cares can go here: http://nisamerica.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=103&t=15014

    And please keep it civil. Your points should be able to stand on their own and further attacks of insults or aggressiveness will only serve as a detraction.

  • Kudan

    I say be thankful you are getting the game, you don’t have to look that hard to find the fanservice you want from this game. Censorship sucks but if you don’t buy such a niche game like this just to get a hard on for girls moaning in japanese then you clos the door for others with a better overall quality.

    • Bob Slim

      Moaning in japaese lol is that what they want
      I dont care about that much as long as the artwork is there im good

      • Kudan

        Yeah i think they’re removing the sounds the girls make when you are, punishing them… and puting some steam so you don’t get to look some of the most provocative parts i guess. So yeah all the artwork is there but just with a little steam over the naked parts maybe.

      • darke

        They’re censoring the artwork as well; it sounds like you care about that.

        • Bob Slim

          Yeah I do thats what I want to know will the steam effect the artwork too,I ask that question but I dont think I will get a answer yet but had to try

  • Bryce Ward

    This whole thing reminded me of the “han shot first” fiasco.

  • http://hanzoadam.tumblr.com/ Hanzoadam

    “A key part of our localization philosophy is keeping
    games as true to the original as possible when we bring them to the
    West. Unfortunately due to rating issues and regional regulations, we
    sometimes have to work with our developers to make minor changes to game
    content. ”

    means we have stripped all the ecchi content out of the game for you,

    • Kudan

      In order for you to be able to play it, isn’t that the most important thing? eveyone just want the game as it is but doesn’t care if NISA is able to make a profit or even able to release the game, they just want them to bring all this niche games like it was so easy.

      • darke

        Some would argue that stripping out and reanimating content results in a game that is not the original anyway.

        I’d certainly object if I bought a print of the Mona Lisa only for it to arrive with a Hijab or Niqab painted over the top of her.

        • LeBronista

          Apple to Orange..

          • darke

            The Mona Lisa is just another portrait of a female, nothing special; but clearly it’s not respecting some religious and societal traditions so needs to be properly clothed. Or something.

            Don’t worry; I’m sure someday something you care about will be censored in a way that annoys you, and people will be all, like, “Apples and Oranges..” to you as well.

          • LeBronista

            I doubt that.. I don’t play games to see nude loli girls

          • darke

            I don’t either.

            I don’t like violence either, but when a game wasn’t released in Australia because it was too violent, I wasn’t impressed.

            Maybe you like shooting nazis? Well in Germany all the Nazi symbols are censored.

            I can’t tell what you’re going to be disappointed by being censored; but if too many people have your attitude, you can guarantee one day you will find something you like censored, and you won’t like it.

          • LeBronista

            Not a big fan of shooters.. i’m into JRPGs mostly.. and in my 23 years of being a gamer, censorship doesn’t hit me that hard, specially if they have to censor out part of the game with sexual content like this one.. and i try to understand that a game will be more marketable if it recieved a “teen” or even a “mature” rating compared to an “adult only”, specially considering how the ps vita is doing outside of japan..

  • Warboss Aohd

    i’m gonna go ahead and say based on a quote i saw on Gajinworks forums, if they didn’t censor this, it would have gotten an AO rating, they ran it by the ESRB and censored it because there was no way it was getting released uncensored.

    They had ZERO choice.

    • darke

      So, going by a random quote, on a forum unrelated to the company in question, or game in question, you’re making a concrete, absolute statement from it? I’m sure I can find some random nobody on the siliconera forums to quote to say that NIS had a choice if you really want?

      Here, at least make your opinions from an official source: http://nisamerica.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=103&t=15014

      There’s also the official press releases from NIS here: http://nisamerica.com/index.php?nav=pressrel Though there’s no announcement of the localisation of the game there, unlike other games like Natural Selection being announced for localisation in previous press releases.

      • Warboss Aohd

        the quote was from there

    • kanade3

      The ESRB,and other rating boards told NISA that the game could maybe get a AO rating,and not will without a doubt get a AO rating. The rating boards can only suggest what rating you may get,but nothing is set in stone until the game is actually rated.

      • Warboss Aohd

        now THERE is a good criticism of my comment and is likely correct.

        Still, point remains they may have gotten the AO rating if they didn’t. Might not have been set in stone, but very few companies would take that risk.

  • nobitakun

    I’m tired it is always the same situation with US. Fu**ing mother or parents associations and other terrible crazy organizations are in the lead to game classification aka ESRB. Here in europe is also this senseless situation. What a damned mother or father knows what’s better for their children in a field they really don’t know ANYTHING. Stop NOW, I love ecchi. What would you do without porn?. If you can rate porn YOU CAN RATE ecchi. Else, die.

    • Shippoyasha

      That’s the thing I guess. Ratings should be there to just be a warning sign, not something that actually influences changes to content. Just too much politics.

  • Petey

    as someone who has played criminal girls to completion several times and is on her third play-through, i’m gonna voice my opinion here.

    unnecessary censorship makes me so upset so i was ticked about NISA deciding to bring criminal girls over but take out – not the punishment scenes – but the voice clips during and then adding more fog although the act of punishing gradually lifts the fog the higher level you go. so they’re essentially getting rid of the only reason you’d WANT to punish the girls and any kind of sign that they too enjoy their punishment (the things they say as you get to higher levels of punishment give away the fact that they like it, too and i don’t see the problem with sexy babes liking the fact that their warden -whom gradually befriends and takes an active role in helping them overcome their sins at this point- is rubbing oil on them). sure the game is blatant fanservice but you cannot sell a game as something it is clearly not. the story and punishment system are closely interrelated but the game becomes void of any chance of reasonably liking it outside of the punishment system if you take away the fluff.

    the thing is, despite what prude art students want to believe, this game is art. someone sat down and worked for a long time designing the characters and writing the “plot” and then someone spent a long time programming it into actuality. what NISA is doing is UNNECESSARY CENSORSHIP. censorship that clearly spits in the face of artistic integrity. so it has young girls in it who are flat-chested? it is also COMPLETE FANTASY and changing the age in script (something that wouldn’t change the experience at ALL) could easily silence that issue.

    good thing i bought the Japanese version. seriously, just buy the Japanese version. although i do wish there was a way those of us who purchase the original versions to avoid all of the censorship were counted, etc.

    • darke

      Interesting; that sounds like I’ll have the same problem with this censorship as I had with Monmon. Granted in Monmon I didn’t care about the art (I play it on the way to work and back so skimpy cartoon girls are something of an inconvenience), but after doing all the annoying ‘rubbing’ minigame, you felt like you didn’t get a reward because the picture didn’t change. Sure you had the ‘result’, the better card, but it just felt unrewarding. :(

  • http://twitter.com/matty_125 matty

    I’ve been feeling a bit detached from NISA lately. I’ve been wondering why, too, but I suppose it’s because they’re not as upfront as they used to when they really needed support from their audience.

    I remember their old forums from around 2008, and there were comments if not made by the staff then by mods who were close to the company that were pretty upfront on criticisms on the quality of their work. Even if they fumbled here and there back then I still supported them. I appreciate their efforts still, but I don’t know. Even having this questionable feelings is making me doubtful and a bit guilty, too.

  • Guest

    >NISA is quickly and hurriedly trying to joined the hallowed ranks of companies well known for their “quality,” such as EA and Bioware.

    Ha ha ha…no.

  • Matthew Wong

    Actually he works for the company. He also acts as the company’s representative on the board. And when something isn’t the way you want, don’t just say “its all LIESSSSSS”.

    Also I suspect your lying, because they don’t ban everyone speaking out against the censorship, only the people spewing insults. Try looking at the game’s board, where there are ton of people upset and not banned…

  • Bob Slim

    He do work for nisa ,man if you be on the forums you would know

  • DanijoEX ♬ the Cosmic Owl

    Really…tell me so then. I’m hardly taken what you said…

  • Demeanor

    Might I add the European online store prices to the mix?
    They’re (rightfully) getting bashed from that as well.
    Given, I still love their games and am gonna keep buying them (possibly us digital releases) as long as they pump out things that are in tune with my tastes.
    As for censorship I’d rather play the untouched version (I think no possible amount of loli pics might push me to take any sort of initiative irl, it’s just unthinkable) but I’m not gonna ignore the 99% of a game because of minor censorship on that 1%, that’s why I perfectly enjoy my MonMon time even with the same-face cards.
    EDIT: what is this? I just received a whopping 40£ “gift certificate” for the eu store? They’re trying to bribe us now?…
    -_-

  • http://linkapics.tumblr.com/ Linka

    Okay, I’m sorry. I really need to point this out:

    Nowhere did they say they sent in the final copy of the game. I saw their statement, and I saw Houk’s statement, and they said they sent in scenes and parts of the game to be looked over, unofficially, to get a response. And they did. This is what they claim, and to be honest, much as people are willing to not believe them, I believe the word of someone who works there over people who are giving subjective statements without being a part of the company.

    Also, who’s to say they haven’t been working on the game? Far as I know, game localization isn’t something that starts right when the announcement comes out. Game localization starts long before the public knows. I think it’s very unfair to start claiming that they haven’t had time to work on the game in any substantial amount.

  • shadowind

    NISA shill!?! I don’t know what you’ve been taking, but I’d seriously stay off them if I were you!

    Just because I’m not one of those who doesn’t whine and moan because a game is being censored, even in a very minor manner like this one is, it doesn’t make me a damn shill!

  • Zero_Destiny

    Okay just no. The very last line is enough for me to take everything you said and no longer consider it a serious argument. Try again. And remember to have respect when you talk to the members of this community.

    Warned.

  • Maksim Tsirulnik

    A little off-subject but I still want to add it.

    Houk’s job actually isn’t to moderate the forums either. He does that in his own free time since he does actually like interacting with users.

    Can’t imagine how demoralizing it must be sometimes though. Tries his best to be as clear and helpful as possible…and only gets crap in return.

  • Matthew Wong

    I know this is hard for someone on the hate bandwagon, but the rating boards don’t need the English version to judge the questionable content, which is what they sent. They know those sounds were moans and sexual sounds and not the girls saying things like “E=MC^2″. How would the images have changed between two un censored versions? They wouldn’t have. NISA got the feedback, and it wasn’t good. What similar games? What games have you sexually punishing girls? Stop the blind hate and false accusations.

  • Aesma

    Actually, I am wondering about that too. Mugen Soul kept its Japanese voice in the US version, and they sound quite erotic (If a bit funny).

    Perhaps it was because in Mugen Soul, the voice came from mini game and post game bonus content while here it is part of the ‘main’ game?

  • Asianwarwallabe

    That’s great, but your premise has one small flaw.

    Sending in Japanese elements of the game to be rated, even unofficially, for the Western market is without merit. The boards can not give you an accurate assessment of the sort of rating you can expect to receive based on this, as it’s not actually the final version of the game being shipped out. Anything they say could be subject to change, as NISA (or anyone else doing this) could change elements of what they had judged, thus changing the rating they would potentially receive.

    The point is that no matter what NISA sent in to the boards, it’s completely and utterly irrelevant to the final rating the game would expect to receive, and thus their decision to censor based on it has no merit.

    It’s a dishonest policy based on dishonest values. It reeks of a desperate attempt to spin this fiasco to their favor, in any way, shape, or form, possible. It’s damage control.

  • http://linkapics.tumblr.com/ Linka

    I am not arguing specifically that it might be dishonest or not; the practices of companies is something that I’m interested in personally on an analysis standpoint, and it might, in fact, be dishonest on their part. That isn’t the point I’m making with my comment, though.

    My point is that nowhere did they say they sent in the final version, and are forward on the point that they only sent in scenes and dialogue from the game to get an unofficial view from their contacts in the ratings board– whereas your comment implies that you feel they have claimed a final build judgment, and that they’re lying about it. That’s all.

  • butts

    No, but blindly accepting censorship for any reason, even when it has been pointed out by other companies that there’s no need for it, and then defending NISA for doing so does make you one.

    They’re selling you a product that they’ve changed for literally no reason and you’re eating it up without question and trying to convince yourself and others it’s not a problem.. You’d make a great PR rep.

  • DizzyGear

    Worse is when a good comunity rep wants to defuse a situation but can give nothing but canned answers due to NDA’s or they simply dont know more than we do.

    Its prolly the most thankless job in the gaming world. i often feel sorry for Jawad from the SCEE blog.

  • Matthew Wong

    Reading comprehension…Frankly you shouldn’t look in a mirror when commenting.

    You can’t change a moan in a mini game to be anything else but a moan no matter the region. Actually they followed your overall advice about changing things in a minor way and just removed the voice clips and added a bit of fog. I find it funny that you think overtly punishing girls/woman in a game sexually would not cause the rating to shoot up to AO. They changed the mini game, how would an English version been different ? Oh but don’t bother responding since you clearly have nothing constructive to say.

  • Asianwarwallabe

    “I find it funny that you think overtly punishing girls/woman in a game sexually would not cause the rating to shoot up to AO.”

    You find it funny because you’re an illiterate moron who hasn’t read the damn guidelines.

    The ESRB and PEGI are both LESS strict on this shit than CERO is. If it was released without the Z rating over there, then NISA would have to actively try to get an AO rating to make it so over here.

    I’ll repeat it again as many times as necessary. Educate yourself.

  • Dewey Defeats Truman

    Why should I be grateful?

    And if I’m a peasant, does that make you the patrician? Because you take anything without thinking about whether or not it’s good?

    I’d honestly rather never get something than get a butchered version.

  • Robert Dexter

    As a responsible consumer I am not going to by a game that has been censored. Just because they got the game does not mean I have to be grateful, especially when they go and screw it up.

  • SaiyanJedi_Trunks

    Ungrateful peasants? Does that make you a PC overload? :)

  • http://linkapics.tumblr.com/ Linka

    Can you point out specifically where he refused to acknowledge that anything was sent or that they talked to anyone?

    You do sorta realize that even with attempting to be forward, there are some things a company /cannot/ say, due to contracts? I mean, geeze, the fact that you’re posting pictures of a private convo you had with him is sorta telling of why they have to be careful of what they say. :(

  • Zero_Destiny

    This is a pretty straw man argument. I’m deleting it now.

  • James Galizio

    11 and everything beyond that. He then refused to respond to my post (17)

  • PenguinPlayer

    Rating boards are very open about their rating process. Once somebody e-mailed PEGI and they answered all their questions regarding the rating of three games. While ESRB is obviously not PEGI, I see no reason for them to hide any information like that.

  • http://linkapics.tumblr.com/ Linka

    Reading through those posts, I do not see any point where he refused to acknowledge it. He gives vague statements, yes. Maybe it’s just me, but even with stuff like this, a person working at a company like that literally cannot say specific things. They can and will get reprimanded, or even fired for it.

  • Dkmariolink

    Im not a troll. Its thanks to Xseed and NIS (and some others) that these Niche games even get localized.

    If you all boycott these games, NIS and Xseed will not continue to localize them.

  • http://linkapics.tumblr.com/ Linka

    Maybe, but it might be different in this case where it seems to be stepping on broken glass otherwise, overall.

    Of course, with the example you gave, was it cause the games were already officially rated? That might be a difference.

  • Ondin

    They should go in depth since they pretty much lied about “working” with said rating boards.

  • James Galizio

    Stating that he has nothing left that he can share is a very strong remark, when he has stated in the past – and eventually the future! – that they had contacted the ratings board in an unofficial capacity. When I asked specifically what that exchange was like, he then said that he had shared everything that he could.

    That is refusal to explain what actually happened with the ratings board, if not in a way that you may be accustomed to expect. It’s misleading and a lie.

  • Yaro

    I personally am not boycotting everythiing the company does, I only do not support things I do no agree with. That’s why I bought demon gaze, disgaeas and soon natural doctrine. I will have to see the final version of CG before deciding. But I dont want to support censorship with my money. If you do thats fine. You dont need to feel superior about it.

  • Dewey Defeats Truman

    The issue is that XSEED does not change or remove content from their games while NISA does.

    I buy XSEED games because of their policy on questionable content, and don’t buy many (if any, lately) NISA games because of their policies for questionable content.

  • butts

    There’s no reason to boycott Xseed though since they don’t censor their releases and their translation quality is much higher.

    Xseed reps have even said that they cannot understand why NISA goes through such lengths to censor themselves when they don’t have to in pretty much all cases.

  • Shippoyasha

    I find it insulting that someone would bring Xseed to the level of NISA.

  • http://linkapics.tumblr.com/ Linka

    I dunno. Something just doesn’t feel right to me about either side of the argument.

    I feel like there’s a lot more to this than just a dodging of your question– yeah, it feels misleading for you. Though I think going “the future!” tells me that /maybe/ he talked to the person above him who can give the okay of what info can go out to the public. Maybe when he talked to you, he couldn’t give any more than he did. But now that it’s today and he could talk to someone else there, he finds it’s okay to give a bit more.

    I can understand the feeling of being left out about responses though, though you said you did the conversation with him last night, right? Given the timestamps on the messages, have you uh. Ever considered a more innocent reasoning for the cut-off, namely that he might’ve had to go to sleep?

  • Dkmariolink

    Well, thats a good idea. The more we boycott games with censorship, the less likely we get games with censorship.

    And it is bullcrap that we get games with horrible gore and rape, but games with boobies and pantie shots get censored up the arse.

  • James Galizio

    He claimed days before my conversation with him, that they had talked to employees of the ratings board. If something had changed since then, he still had lied to someone prior to the press release today.

    Also, a friend was talking with him; and he had been given a response a full half hour after I had posted my final message. I still do not have a response to my message even now.

    There are no excuses.

  • Yaro

    It seems like you understand why people find this whole affair to be unacceptable and are speaking out. So if you really aren’t just a troll, consider voicing your opinion in a more agreeable and productive manner. Unless you just want to rustle some feathers.

  • http://linkapics.tumblr.com/ Linka

    I saw no denial that they talked to the guys– I just see dodging of specifics of what they talked about, other than, like he said, what he already publicly posted. It isn’t lying, and I was working under the assumption that the claim came today– not days before.

    That point though of him still being up, okay, I can sorta give that. Of course, I think it’d be weirder to believe that you were also the only one he was talking to.

  • shadowind

    As I said before, I hate censorship as much as the next person, but if something has yo be censored for cultural reasons or something similar, then that’s a whole different matter.

    As I also said before, I’m not bothered about what people like you think shout the game being censored because I’m still going to buy it along with the other rational people who’ve posted here saying that they’re going to buy it. The story is still going to be the same, it’s just a couple of very, very minor things that have been changed and I don’t see what the problem is…

    And FYI, I still don’t think that I’m a shill… ^_^

  • James Galizio

    He stated that he had nothing left to share, when if they had talked to the ratings board in the capacity that they claimed they had… that is certainly false.

    You can call that dodging of specifics; but I’d say that would be lying outright.

  • Dkmariolink

    I meant that those 2 companies are big when it comes to bringing Japanese games over…

    And Atlus I guess

  • Dewey Defeats Truman

    The game is made for and primarily marketed to those otakus you mention in Japan though, and they are almost definitely the primary demographic for it in the states as well. I understand wanting to sell more copies to the masses who would be put off by such a thing, I really do. But with something like this it seems rather counter-productive.

    And it’s hardly “softcore Hentai.” There’s no nudity, and at best it all amounts to foreplay. Sexual in nature sure, but not outright porn.

  • butts

    Trying to appeal to everyone instead of “otakus” is both foolish and pointless when said “otakus” who make up the majority of the target audience will be turned away from it and it will do little to bring in people who weren’t already interested in the game in the first place.

    Both Mugen Souls proved that censoring features does nothing to improve things saleswise, so why NISA continues to persist in that reasoning is a mystery.

  • PenguinPlayer

    Making a version for everyone but otakus of a game that’s clearly aimed at otakus is an ill-advised move for a localization company. Both financially and PR.

  • Dkmariolink

    Have you ever seen a hentai game? Google Artificial Academy or Monster Girl Quest.

    Ignorant people man…

  • Yaro

    Softcore hentai is the truest oxymoron I have ever seen.

  • Aesma

    …softcore hentai? …what softcore hentai? The main problem with this is that the scene they removed, is a part of the ‘main’ game, and can be important to determine and show the characterization of the girls in the game.

    If NISA can show the girls’ personality and characterization correctly, even with the… ‘moves’ they are taking right now, I’ll be fine with that.

    But, as my experience playing NISA games with Japanese voice has shown, sometimes NISA took liberty in their translation and changed the ‘personality’ or at least, quirks of the characters in their game. Thus, my disappointment hearing the removal of Japanese dub in said scene.

  • Dkmariolink

    Lol, im a multigamer. PC gamer, PS gamer, and Handheld gamer haha

  • Shippoyasha

    Maybe their company size perhaps. I just think NISA has had way too much trouble brewing over censorship not just for this game, but for many, many titles the past decade while guys like Atlus and Xseed are firm believers of not changing visual content (though aural content is another matter sometimes with Atlus, at least they seem to do dual audio a lot more these days).

  • Matthew Wong

    Was there anything actually true or constructive in what you posted? You conveniently ignored the part where NISA sent this stuff to ALL the
    rating boards. ESRB isn’t the only rating board. NISA doesn’t have the funds to release multiple versions of a game.

    Also you mention “blatantly lying as reps from other companies have pointed out”, which
    itself is a lie. It’s funny how you take the word of one company over another just because you don’t like what one company has to do to get
    the game released.

    You really shouldn’t say I’m ignorant when you
    lied about Houk and don’t understand how many rating boards there are. I also fail to see why you have so much hate for NISA when they are bringing the game over and only doing minor censors.

  • butts

    Me and several other people have pointed out about how what they’ve said about submitting it to the ESRB has been completely untrue, yet you still don’t seem to understand. Nothing you have said or tried to argue has even given the slightest inclination that you know how the ESRB works, because if you did there’s no logical way you could sit there with a straight face and continue to claim this stuff.

    It’s over. You keep jumping from one strawman to another or making more excuses without acknowledging any previous points or bringing anything to back you up when others have.

    You’re dead set on defending a company and what they’re doing for no reason without even knowing what you’re talking about. This goes far beyond ignorance. You’re just in denial now.

  • Zero_Destiny

    @Juan Manuel M. Suárez

    @Yaro

    We’re done here. Both of you. This fighting is over, all right. It’s off topic and getting personal.

    Thanks.

  • Zero_Destiny

    Different corporations have different mind sets and different issues when they approach their games. There is no golden standard to how a game is handled. Just because some games got by doesn’t mean other games won’t.

    It’s honestly a random process that has far more variables in it than you seem to realize with your past comments. Sorry if that comes off a bit aggressive, as you are welcomes to support, or not support what you want, and have made some decent arguments.

    But there is a lot to consider in how a game is handled and even the peeps at XSeed (who are ubber cool) don’t know the full picture, and can’t tell you everything here. They do offer a good opinion on the matter though, and can be used for comparisons, but unless the employees at XSeed are also the employees at NISA, and handling this game in particular, they really can’t give you anything outside of an insider’s opinion on the matter.

  • Matthew Wong

    Really? I am using the stawman? You ignored what I said in my comment. Respond to that instead of insulting me for no reason other then I am defending NISA. Also you and other people have not proven a single thing. They sent the most extreme footage to ALL THE RATING BOARDS. That’s in caps because you ignored that in the last comment. I have brought stuff to back me up, quotes from Houk about how NISA approached the game. It’s you who hasn’t provided a single announce of evidence. You can keep saying NISA is lying about it all you want, but all that amounts to is a conspiracy theory.

  • James Galizio

    How was it a straw-man? How am I misrepresenting what he said to me?

  • butts

    How is a screencapped conversation at all a strawman?

    It’s not like he was making up Houk’s responses himself or inferring anything. It was clear cut dialogue between the two of them and there was absolutely no reason to delete it.

  • Asianwarwallabe

    You should probably learn what a strawman argument is before deleting vast swathes of conversation because of it.

  • Zero_Destiny

    You know what? Actually, I’m done with this.

    You have done nothing but spread misinformation on this thread, call others names, accuse others of spreading misinformation, make claims that you cannot back up, and just all around been plain unpleasant and rude.

    You’re banned.

  • DanijoEX ♬ the Cosmic Owl

    Keep at it, bucky…keep at it. No skin off my bones. Hahaha.

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